People v. Perez ( 2020 )


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  •         IN THE SUPREME COURT OF
    CALIFORNIA
    THE PEOPLE,
    Plaintiff and Respondent,
    v.
    JOSE LUIS PEREZ et al.,
    Defendants and Appellants.
    S248730
    Fourth Appellate District, Division Two
    E060438
    San Bernardino County Superior Court
    FV1901482
    February 27, 2020
    This opinion precedes companion case S249872,
    also filed on February 27, 2020.
    Justice Groban authored the opinion of the Court, in which
    Chief Justice Cantil-Sakauye and Justices Chin, Corrigan, Liu,
    Cuéllar, and Kruger concurred.
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    S248730
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    People v. Sanchez (2016) 
    63 Cal.4th 665
     (Sanchez) held that
    an expert cannot relate case-specific hearsay to explain the basis
    for his or her opinion unless the facts are independently proven
    or fall within a hearsay exception. We concluded that if the
    prosecution expert seeks to relate testimonial hearsay, the
    confrontation clause is violated unless there is a showing of
    unavailability and the defendant had a prior opportunity for
    cross-examination or forfeited that right. We granted review in
    this case to determine whether a defendant’s failure to object at
    trial, before Sanchez was decided, forfeited a claim that a gang
    expert’s testimony related case-specific hearsay in violation of
    the confrontation clause. We now conclude that a defense
    counsel’s failure to object under such circumstances does not
    forfeit a claim based upon Sanchez. Accordingly, we reverse the
    judgment of the Court of Appeal here, which reached the
    opposite conclusion.
    I. BACKGROUND
    On June 23, 2009, a motorist driving on U.S. Highway 395
    near Victorville encountered a man walking on the road and
    bleeding from gunshot wounds to his face and abdomen. Police
    arrived on the scene and followed a trail of blood to a pickup
    truck parked a few blocks away. There, the police found two
    other men, who had both died from gunshot wounds.
    1
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    The surviving victim told police that he had been
    kidnapped a few days earlier in the city of South Gate, near Los
    Angeles. He was visiting a house on Center Street when a group
    of men held him at gunpoint and tied him up with zip ties. The
    group forced the victim to call two other acquaintances and
    summon them to the house. Upon their arrival, the group then
    bound the other two as well. The group forced the three victims
    to arrange for deliveries of money and drugs, which the group
    then took. The group put the victims into vehicles and drove
    them away from the house. The three victims were eventually
    shot and left for dead near Victorville. The survivor identified a
    person named “Lalo” as the shooter.
    In police interviews, defendant Jose Luis Perez admitted
    that he was present during the crimes up to just before the
    shooting and that his participation consisted of duct-taping a
    sock over the eyes of one of the victims and then putting him in
    zip ties. Perez stated that he got into a vehicle when the group
    left the house with the victims, but that the vehicle he was in
    lost track of the other vehicles. Perez incriminated his
    codefendants Edgar Ivan Chavez Navarro (“Chavez”) and Pablo
    Sandoval, as well as Sabas Iniguez, Caesar Rodriguez, and
    Eduardo Alvarado (nicknamed “Lalo”). Perez admitted he heard
    the plan was to rob the victims and kill them but claimed that
    he was not supposed to be present and that the others simply
    showed up earlier than expected at the house on Center Street
    while he was there. Perez claimed that Sandoval threatened to
    kill him and his family if he talked.
    Chavez, Perez, and Sandoval were all tried together, but
    Perez had a separate jury. Iniguez testified against them
    pursuant to plea bargain. He testified that a drug dealer named
    “Max” owed a debt to other drug dealers (the victims here) for
    2
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    methamphetamine. Max was a cartel member and Sandoval
    reported to him. Alvarado was also a cartel member and Chavez
    reported to him. One of the victims who died was a cartel
    member and reported to “Nacho,” i.e., the “big boss” in
    Guadalajara. The surviving victim reported to that decedent
    victim. Max planned to ambush his creditors and rob them of
    drugs and money. Iniguez, Sandoval, Chavez, Perez, Alvarado,
    Rodriguez, and three unknown persons all assisted in carrying
    out the plan.
    The prosecution’s gang expert Jeff Moran testified that the
    Sinaloa    drug    cartel   produces      large   amounts       of
    methamphetamine, cocaine, and marijuana and transports
    them to the United States to sell. The cartel operates as a
    franchise and is divided into territories, which are subdivided
    into cells. Each cell connects to someone in the cartel, but each
    cell works independently of the other cells. At the time of trial,
    “El Chapo” Guzman was the head of the Sinaloa cartel. “Nacho”
    was Ignacio Coronel, who was killed in 2010. At the time of the
    offenses, Coronel worked in Guadalajara and was number three
    in the Sinaloa drug cartel. In Moran’s opinion, Iniguez,
    Sandoval, Chavez, Perez, Alvarado, and Rodriguez were all
    members or associates of the Sinaloa drug cartel. He testified
    that the group’s coordinated efforts are consistent with members
    or associates of a criminal street gang acting in association or in
    concert with each other. He testified that he formed his opinions
    based upon his training, experiences, and information obtained
    from this investigation. This included information obtained
    from interviews he and other detectives conducted, Perez’s
    statements to police, trial testimony, classes, Internet research,
    reports, articles about the Guzman cartel, and regular
    discussions with Drug Enforcement Administration agents
    3
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    about cartels. Defense counsel did not object to Moran’s
    testimony on hearsay, confrontation clause, or Evidence Code
    section 352 grounds. To establish the pattern of criminal gang
    activity, the court took judicial notice that Alvarado, Iniguez,
    and Rodriguez had been convicted of murder, attempted
    murder, and kidnapping, based upon the same events charged
    in the present case.1
    On October 31 and November 1, 2013, the juries convicted
    Chavez, Sandoval, and Perez each of two counts of first degree
    special circumstance murder (Pen. Code, §§ 187, subd. (a),
    190.2, subd. (a)),2 one count of attempted premeditated murder
    (§§ 664, 187, subd. (a)), three counts of kidnapping for ransom (§
    209, subd. (a)), three counts of kidnapping to commit robbery (§
    209, subd. (b)(1)), and one count of street terrorism (§ 186.22,
    subd. (a)). The jury found true gang (§ 186.22, subd. (b)) and
    firearm (§ 12022.53, subds. (d) & (e)(1)) enhancements. The
    trial court sentenced each defendant to five terms of life without
    the possibility of parole.
    Defendants appealed. In 2016, before the appeals were
    resolved, we issued our opinion in Sanchez, supra, 
    63 Cal.4th 665
    . In supplemental briefing, Chavez argued in the Court of
    Appeal that the gang expert’s testimony was hearsay and had
    been presented to the jury in violation of the confrontation
    clause. Chavez claimed that the gang expert testified to case-
    1
    Alvarado and Rodriguez were tried separately and were
    convicted of similar offenses as the defendants in this matter.
    Perez was originally tried jointly with Iniguez on the same
    charges here but with different juries. Iniguez’s jury convicted
    him on all counts, but Perez’s hung on all counts.
    2
    All further unspecified statutory references refer to the
    Penal Code.
    4
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    specific hearsay in the following ways: (1) Iniguez admitting he
    was a cartel member; (2) Sandoval’s activities showed that he
    was a cartel member; (3) sources told Moran that Sandoval was
    the one who had direct contact with Max, who was calling the
    shots; (4) based on his “involvement and participation in this
    investigation,” Moran believed Chavez was a cartel associate
    who worked directly for Lalo; (5) Moran’s investigation,
    including Perez’s admission to law enforcement, led Moran to
    believe Perez was a low-level associate who wanted to work for
    Sandoval and his involvement in this case was an audition; and
    (6) sources told Moran and other investigators that the crimes
    in this case were part of a cartel-ordered hit.
    The Court of Appeal held that Chavez’s failure to object to
    case-specific hearsay in expert testimony at trial forfeited any
    Sanchez claim on appeal. The Court of Appeal found that
    “[e]ven though this case was tried before Sanchez was decided,
    previous cases had already indicated that an expert’s testimony
    to hearsay was objectionable. If anything, Sanchez narrowed
    the scope of a meritorious objection by limiting it to case-specific
    hearsay.” Therefore, “such objections would not have been
    futile.”
    Defendants petitioned for review.       We granted the
    petitions and transferred the matter for the Court of Appeal to
    reconsider the cause in light of recent amendments to the
    firearm enhancement statutes. (See § 12022.53, subd. (h),
    added by Stats. 2017, ch. 682, § 1.) On our own motion, we also
    directed the Reporter of Decisions not to publish the opinion.
    Upon the case’s return, as relevant here, the Court of Appeal
    again held that Chavez’s counsel’s failure to object in the trial
    court forfeited any objection to expert testimony to case-specific
    5
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    hearsay under Sanchez. (People v. Perez (2018) 
    22 Cal.App.5th 201
    , 212.)
    Defendants Chavez and Perez petitioned for review. We
    granted Chavez’s petition to consider the limited issue of
    whether defendant’s failure to object at trial, before Sanchez
    was decided, forfeited his claim that a gang expert’s testimony
    related case-specific hearsay in violation of his Sixth
    Amendment right to confrontation. We denied Perez’s petition.
    II. DISCUSSION
    Chavez argues that, even though he did not raise a
    confrontation clause objection to the gang expert’s testimony at
    the time of trial, he did not forfeit the claim because Sanchez
    had not yet been decided and such an objection would therefore
    have been futile. We agree.
    Ordinarily, “the failure to object to the admission of expert
    testimony or hearsay at trial forfeits an appellate claim that
    such evidence was improperly admitted.” (People v. Stevens
    (2015) 
    62 Cal.4th 325
    , 333; accord, Evid. Code, § 353, subd. (a).)
    “ ‘The reason for the [objection] requirement is manifest: a
    specifically grounded objection to a defined body of evidence
    serves to prevent error. It allows the trial judge to consider
    excluding the evidence or limiting its admission to avoid
    possible prejudice. It also allows the proponent of the evidence
    to lay additional foundation, modify the offer of proof, or take
    other steps designed to minimize the prospect of reversal.’ ”
    (People v. Partida (2005) 
    37 Cal.4th 428
    , 434.) Even when not
    required under our forfeiture doctrine, an objection can still
    serve these important purposes and can be crucial to developing
    the law.
    6
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    Nevertheless, “[a]s this court has explained, ‘[r]eviewing
    courts have traditionally excused parties for failing to raise an
    issue at trial where an objection would have been futile or wholly
    unsupported by substantive law then in existence.’ ” (People v.
    Brooks (2017) 
    3 Cal.5th 1
    , 92, quoting People v. Welch (1993) 
    5 Cal.4th 228
    , 237.) Indeed, “ ‘ “[w]e have excused a failure to
    object where to require defense counsel to raise an objection
    ‘would place an unreasonable burden on defendants to
    anticipate unforeseen changes in the law and encourage
    fruitless objections in other situations where defendants might
    hope that an established rule of evidence would be changed on
    appeal.’ ” ’ ” (People v. Edwards (2013) 
    57 Cal.4th 658
    , 705
    (Edwards).) “In determining whether the significance of a
    change in the law excuses counsel’s failure to object at trial, we
    consider the ‘state of the law as it would have appeared to
    competent and knowledgeable counsel at the time of the trial.’ ”
    (People v. Black (2007) 
    41 Cal.4th 799
    , 811 (Black), quoting
    People v. De Santiago (1969) 
    71 Cal.2d 18
    , 23.)             “The
    circumstance that some attorneys may have had the foresight to
    raise th[e] issue does not mean that competent and
    knowledgeable counsel reasonably could have been expected to
    have anticipated the high court’s decision . . . .” (Black, at p.
    812.)
    At the time of Chavez’s trial, People v. Gardeley (1996) 
    14 Cal.4th 605
     and People v. Montiel (1993) 
    5 Cal.4th 877
    , 919
    (Montiel) were controlling authority on expert testimony.
    Gardeley permitted a qualified expert witness to testify on direct
    examination to any sufficiently reliable hearsay sources used in
    formulation of the expert’s opinion. (See Gardeley, at p. 618.)
    Consequently, “[c]ourts created a two-pronged approach to
    balancing ‘an expert’s need to consider extrajudicial matters,
    7
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    and a jury’s need for information sufficient to evaluate an expert
    opinion’ so as not to ‘conflict with an accused’s interest in
    avoiding substantive use of unreliable hearsay.’ ” (Sanchez,
    supra, 63 Cal.4th at p. 679, quoting Montiel, at p. 919.) “Most
    often, hearsay problems [were] cured by an instruction that
    matters admitted through an expert go only to [the] basis of the
    opinion and should not be considered for their truth. [Citation.]
    [¶] Sometimes a limiting instruction [was] not . . . enough. In
    such cases, Evidence Code section 352 authorize[d] the court to
    exclude from an expert’s testimony any hearsay matter whose
    irrelevance, unreliability, or potential for prejudice outweighs
    its proper probative value.” (Montiel, at p. 919.)
    After Chavez’s trial, Sanchez found that “this paradigm is
    no longer tenable because an expert’s testimony regarding the
    basis for an opinion must be considered for its truth by the jury.”
    (Sanchez, supra, 63 Cal.4th at p. 679.) Sanchez explained that
    “[w]hen any expert relates to the jury case-specific out-of-court
    statements, and treats the content of those statements as true
    and accurate to support the expert’s opinion, the statements are
    hearsay. It cannot logically be maintained that the statements
    are not being admitted for their truth.” (Id. at p. 686.) “If an
    expert testifies to case-specific out-of-court statements to
    explain the bases for his [or her] opinion, those statements are
    necessarily considered by the jury for their truth, thus rendering
    them hearsay. Like any other hearsay evidence, it must be
    properly admitted through an applicable hearsay exception.
    Alternatively, the evidence can be admitted through an
    appropriate witness and the expert may assume its truth in a
    properly worded hypothetical question in the traditional
    manner.” (Id. at p. 684, fn. omitted.) Sanchez clarified that an
    “expert may still rely on hearsay in forming an opinion, and may
    8
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    tell the jury in general terms that he did so” (id. at p. 685), that
    is, the expert may “relate generally” the “kind and source of the
    ‘matter’ upon which his opinion rests” (id. at p. 686).
    Sanchez consequently disapproved Gardeley “to the extent
    it suggested an expert may properly testify regarding case-
    specific out-of-court statements without satisfying hearsay
    rules.” (Sanchez, supra, 63 Cal.4th at p. 686, fn. 13.) Sanchez
    also disapproved “prior decisions concluding that an expert’s
    basis testimony is not offered for its truth, or that a limiting
    instruction, coupled with a trial court’s evaluation of the
    potential prejudicial impact of the evidence under Evidence
    Code section 352, sufficiently addresses hearsay and
    confrontation concerns.”      (Ibid.)     Specifically, Sanchez
    disapproved People v. Bell (2007) 
    40 Cal.4th 582
    , 608; Montiel,
    
    supra,
     5 Cal.4th at pp. 918–919; People v. Ainsworth (1988) 
    45 Cal.3d 984
    , 1012; People v. Milner (1988) 
    45 Cal.3d 227
    , 238–
    240; and People v. Coleman (1985) 
    38 Cal.3d 69
    , 91–93.
    Sanchez thus expressly changed the law previously
    established by Gardeley and Montiel. “ ‘ “[W]e have excused a
    failure to object where to require defense counsel to raise an
    objection ‘would place an unreasonable burden on defendants to
    anticipate unforeseen changes in the law and encourage
    fruitless objections in other situations where defendants might
    hope that an established rule of evidence would be changed on
    appeal.’ ” ’ ” (Edwards, supra, 57 Cal.4th at p. 705.) We
    therefore hold that the failure of Chavez’s counsel to object at
    trial before Sanchez was decided did not forfeit a claim on appeal
    based upon Sanchez. The great weight of authority below is
    consistent with this ruling. (See, e.g., People v. Flint (2018) 
    22 Cal.App.5th 983
    , 996–997; People v. Hall (2018) 
    23 Cal.App.5th 576
    , 602, fn. 10; Conservatorship of K.W. (2017) 
    13 Cal.App.5th 9
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    1274, 1283; People v. Jeffrey G. (2017) 
    13 Cal.App.5th 501
    , 507–
    508; People v. Meraz (2016) 
    6 Cal.App.5th 1162
    , 1170, fn. 7.)
    This ruling is also consistent with our numerous decisions
    holding that a defendant need not predict subsequent
    substantive changes in law in order to preserve objections. (See
    People v. Chavez (1980) 
    26 Cal.3d 334
    , 350, fn. 5 [failure to object
    to the admissibility of prior inconsistent statements did not
    forfeit claim because a number of appellate cases had upheld the
    admissibility of such statements in the face of similar
    challenges]; In re Gladys R. (1970) 
    1 Cal.3d 855
    , 861 [failure to
    object to trial court’s reading of social services report prior to the
    jurisdictional hearing in a juvenile court proceeding did not
    forfeit issue because a subsequent appellate decision interpreted
    the controlling statutes “in a manner contrary to the apparently
    prevalent contemporaneous interpretation”].)
    The Attorney General, however, argues that three
    confrontation clause cases decided before Chavez’s trial,
    Williams v. Illinois (2012) 
    567 U.S. 50
     (Williams), People v.
    Dungo (2012) 
    55 Cal.4th 608
     (Dungo), and People v. Lopez (2012)
    
    55 Cal.4th 569
     (Lopez), provided grounds for objection, and
    therefore objection at trial would not have been futile.
    By its terms, the confrontation clause provides that “[i]n
    all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right . . .
    to be confronted with the witnesses against him.” (U.S. Const.,
    6th Amend.) In 2004, the high court “adopted a fundamentally
    new interpretation of the confrontation right” (Williams, supra,
    567 U.S. at p. 64) and held that “[w]here testimonial evidence is
    at issue,” the confrontation clause “demands what the common
    law required: unavailability and a prior opportunity for
    cross-examination.” (Crawford v. Washington (2004) 
    541 U.S. 10
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    36, 68.) Relevant here, statements that are not offered for their
    truth do not implicate the confrontation clause. (Id. at p. 59,
    fn. 9; accord, People v. Blacksher (2011) 
    52 Cal.4th 769
    , 808, fn.
    23.) While Gardeley was decided before Crawford, every Court
    of Appeal to address the issue in a published decision after
    Crawford, but before Sanchez, continued to rely on Gardeley to
    reject a confrontation clause challenge. Each of these decisions
    found, contrary to our subsequent decision in Sanchez, that
    expert basis evidence was not offered for its truth. (See People
    v. Hill (2011) 
    191 Cal.App.4th 1104
    , 1127–1128 (Hill); People v.
    Sisneros (2009) 
    174 Cal.App.4th 142
    , 153–154; People v. Cooper
    (2007) 
    148 Cal.App.4th 731
    , 746–747; People v. Fulcher (2006)
    
    136 Cal.App.4th 41
    , 57; People v. Thomas (2005) 
    130 Cal.App.4th 1202
    , 1209–1210.)
    Subsequently, in Williams, the high court held in a four-
    one-four decision that a lab technician’s testimony regarding
    work performed by another lab was not admitted to prove the
    truth of the matter and, alternatively, the underlying outside
    lab report, which was not admitted into evidence, was not
    testimonial. (Williams, supra, 567 U.S. at pp. 57–58, 62, 69–86
    (plur. opn. of Alito, J.).) However, while the plurality opinion
    found that the testimony did not violate the confrontation
    clause, Williams “called into question the continuing validity of
    relying on a not-for-the-truth analysis in the expert witness
    context,” because between the concurrence and the dissent
    “[f]ive justices . . . specifically rejected this approach.” (Sanchez,
    supra, 63 Cal.4th at p. 682.) Justice Thomas concurred
    narrowly in the judgment on the ground the outside lab report
    was not testimonial, but he “share[d] the dissent’s view of the
    plurality’s flawed analysis.” (Williams, 
    supra,
     567 U.S. at p. 104
    (conc. opn. of Thomas, J.); see 
    id.
     at pp. 109–118.) Notably, he
    11
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    found that the challenged testimony was admitted for its truth.
    (Id. at pp. 104–109.) Justice Kagan, joined by three other
    justices in dissent, found both that the statements were
    testimonial and that the challenged testimony was admitted for
    its truth. (Id. at pp. 125–132 (dis. opn. of Kagan, J.).)
    Our court then applied Williams in the companion cases
    of Dungo and Lopez. Dungo held the confrontation clause was
    not violated when an expert testified about objective facts
    concerning the condition of the victim’s body as recorded in an
    autopsy report and autopsy photos. (Dungo, supra, 55 Cal.4th
    at pp. 612–615, 621.) Neither the autopsy report, which a
    nontestifying pathologist had prepared, nor the photographs
    were admitted into evidence. (Id. at p. 612.) Justice Kennard,
    in the majority opinion, reasoned that the evidence was not
    testimonial, but she did not discuss whether the expert’s basis
    testimony was offered for its truth. (Id. at p. 621.) Justice
    Werdegar, in a concurring opinion that three other justices
    joined, also opined that physical observations from the autopsy
    report were not testimonial. (Id. at p. 627 (conc. opn. of
    Werdegar, J.).) In the process, she commented that those
    “observations were introduced for their truth.” (Id. at p. 627.)
    In dissent, Justice Corrigan, joined by Justice Liu, concluded
    that the expert’s “description of [the victim’s] body, drawn from
    the hearsay contained in [the] autopsy report, violated
    defendant’s right to confront and cross-examine [the autopsy
    doctor].” (Id. at p. 647 (dis. opn. of Corrigan, J.).) Justice
    Corrigan noted that “[f]ive justices explicitly repudiated th[e]
    analysis” in the Williams plurality that “[the outside lab] report
    was not hearsay at all because its contents were not admitted
    for their truth.” (Id. at p. 635.)
    12
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    Lopez held that a lab report with defendant’s blood alcohol
    concentration results did not violate the confrontation clause.
    (Lopez, supra, 55 Cal.4th at pp. 582–585.) The analyst who
    prepared the report did not testify, but a colleague testified
    about it and the report was admitted into evidence. (Id. at
    pp. 573–574.) Justice Kennard for the majority reasoned that
    while a notation in the report linking defendant’s name to a
    particular blood sample “was admitted for its truth,” the
    notation was not testimonial. (Id. at p. 584.) Justice Kennard
    observed that in Williams, “[l]ike Justice Thomas in his
    concurrence, the dissent rejected the Williams plurality’s
    conclusion that [the expert’s] testimony about the report was not
    admitted for the truth of the matters asserted in the report.”
    (Id. at p. 580.) In dissent, Justice Liu found that “the records at
    issue here, including the analyst’s notations linking defendant
    to the lab record in question, are testimonial. [Citation.]
    Because the statements were introduced through a surrogate
    with no personal knowledge of those facts, they were offered in
    violation of the confrontation clause.” (Id. at pp. 602–603 (dis.
    opn. of Liu, J.).)
    Based upon these decisions, the Attorney General
    contends that counsel had grounds to object to Gardeley before
    we decided Sanchez because a majority of the justices on our
    court and the high court had reasoned that, at least in certain
    circumstances, testimony concerning the factual basis of an
    expert’s opinion was considered for its truth. The Attorney
    General argues that even before we issued Sanchez, Courts of
    Appeal found that if our court or the high court “were called
    upon to resolve this issue, it seems likely” that cases finding
    “out-of-court statements offered as expert basis evidence are not
    offered for their truth for confrontation purposes will be
    13
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    significantly undermined.” (People v. Valadez (2013) 
    220 Cal.App.4th 16
    , 32 (Valadez); accord, People v. Landau (2016)
    
    246 Cal.App.4th 850
    , 869; People v. Miller (2014) 
    231 Cal.App.4th 1301
    , 1311–1312; People v. Mercado (2013) 
    216 Cal.App.4th 67
    , 89 & fn. 6; Hill, supra, 191 Cal.App.4th at
    p. 1132, fn. 18.)
    Nevertheless, we did not expressly hold until Sanchez that
    “[w]hen any expert relates to the jury case-specific out-of-court
    statements, and treats the content of those statements as true
    and accurate to support the expert’s opinion, the statements are
    hearsay.” (Sanchez, supra, 63 Cal.4th at p. 686.) And Sanchez
    marked a “paradigm” shift in that a limiting instruction was no
    longer an effective method of avoiding hearsay problems in an
    expert’s basis testimony. (Id. at p. 679.) Indeed, no justice
    expressly disapproved Gardeley in either Dungo or Lopez,
    despite it being a staple of our decisional law. (See In re Ruedas
    (2018) 
    23 Cal.App.5th 777
    , 801, fn. 9 [“Gardeley alone was cited
    in over 2,000 appellate decisions between the time it was
    decided in 1996 and the time Sanchez was decided in 2016”].)
    We then continued to cite Gardeley with approval after Dungo
    and Lopez. (See People v. Prunty (2015) 
    62 Cal.4th 59
    , 89 (conc.
    & dis. opn. of Cantil-Sakauye, C. J.) [“A witness testifying in the
    form of an opinion may state on direct examination the basis for
    his or her opinion”]; People v. Jones (2013) 
    57 Cal.4th 899
    , 951
    [“expert testimony can be based on a wide variety of information
    so long as it is reliable”].) Furthermore, at the time of Chavez’s
    trial, Edwards was our most recent decision regarding expert
    testimony relating case-specific hearsay. (See Edwards, supra,
    57 Cal.4th at pp. 706–707.) Edwards, like Dungo and Lopez, did
    not overrule Gardeley, and the Edwards majority stressed that
    14
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    it was not persuaded by the Dungo dissent. (Id. at p. 707, fn.
    13.)
    “The decisions of this court are binding upon and must be
    followed by all the state courts of California.” (Auto Equity
    Sales, Inc. v. Superior Court (1962) 
    57 Cal.2d 450
    , 455.) Until
    we overruled Gardeley, a lower court applying precedent would
    have, under that case, overruled a case-specific hearsay
    objection to expert basis testimony. Indeed, our colleagues in
    the Courts of Appeal repeatedly and expressly stated that they
    were bound to follow Gardeley in the years leading up to
    Sanchez. (See, e.g., Hill, supra, 191 Cal.App.4th at p. 1131 [“our
    position in the judicial hierarchy precludes [rejecting Gardeley];
    we must follow Gardeley and the other California Supreme
    Court cases in the same line of authority”]; accord, In re Thomas
    (2018) 
    30 Cal.App.5th 774
    , 763; People v. Leon (2016) 
    243 Cal.App.4th 1003
    , 1016; Valadez, supra, 220 Cal.App.4th at
    p. 32, fn. 13.) Such a request in a trial court would therefore
    have been futile. (See, e.g., People v. Sandoval (2007) 
    41 Cal.4th 825
    , 837, fn. 4 [request for a jury trial on aggravating
    circumstances “clearly would have been futile” when
    then-existing law required the trial court to deny the request
    and “was binding on the lower courts until it was overruled by
    the high court”]; People v. Gallardo (2017) 
    4 Cal.5th 120
    , 128 [in
    dicta questioning “whether defendant should be made to bear
    the burden of anticipating potential changes in the law based on
    the reasoning of a United States Supreme Court opinion
    addressed to the proper interpretation of a federal statute not at
    issue here”].)
    The Attorney General suggests forfeiture can occur
    whenever the argument is not “legally foreclosed,” or the law is
    “unsettled,” in an “odd state of flux,” or when the high court has
    15
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    not “squarely held as much in a majority opinion,” or when it is
    just a “ ‘restoration’ [citation] of a legal principle that over the
    years had become ‘blurred.’ ” The Attorney General cites cases
    that said this court might be prepared to overrule Gardeley in
    the future. (See, e.g., Valadez, supra, 220 Cal.App.4th at p. 32.)
    The Attorney General cites cases from other states to show
    where the law was trending. The Attorney General argues that
    counsel was required to object because the grounds for objection
    were “not foreclosed by existing law.”
    This, however, is beyond what we have required and too
    amorphous a standard to place on trial counsel.          “The
    circumstance that some attorneys may have had the foresight to
    raise this issue does not mean that competent and
    knowledgeable counsel reasonably could have been expected to
    have anticipated the high court’s decision . . . .” (Black, supra,
    41 Cal.4th at p. 812.) Asking attorneys at the trial level to
    predict that our court might in the future overrule its prior
    precedent — or risk forfeiting constitutional claims of their
    clients — simply requires too much. (See People v. Champion
    (1995) 
    9 Cal.4th 879
    , 908, fn. 6 [“Because the question whether
    defendants have preserved their right to raise this issue on
    appeal is close and difficult, we assume [they] have preserved
    their right, and proceed to the merits”].) It likewise burdens
    trial courts with ruling on objections they have little power to
    sustain unless and until contrary authority is overruled. If
    objection would be futile under current precedent, counsel is not
    obligated to object on pain of forfeiture simply because a future
    change in the law might be foreseeable. Here, Gardeley was still
    binding on lower courts at the time of Chavez’s trial and
    therefore, a trial court applying this precedent would have
    overruled the objection.
    16
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    In an alternative argument, the Attorney General
    contends that even before Sanchez, litigants could “seek to
    exclude testimony by an expert that would have impermissibly
    related case-specific hearsay to juries, relying both on the
    hearsay rule and on section 352 of the Evidence Code.” It is
    undoubtedly true that Chavez could have objected under
    Evidence Code section 352 based on “whether the jury could
    properly follow the court’s limiting instruction in light of the
    nature and amount of the out-of-court statements admitted.”
    (Sanchez, supra, 63 Cal.4th at p. 679.) However, an objection
    under Evidence Code section 352 is completely different from a
    Sanchez objection that the expert has “relate[d] as true case-
    specific facts asserted in hearsay statements.” (Sanchez, at p.
    686.) Thus, the specific objection Sanchez contemplated would
    have been futile under Gardeley and its progeny unless a
    defendant could additionally show that the statements the
    expert related were excessive, inflammatory, or confusing,
    regardless of whether they were case-specific. (See, e.g., People
    v. Coleman (1985) 
    38 Cal.3d 69
    , 93 [court abused its discretion
    by allowing “extensive questioning of the expert witnesses”
    regarding letters written by the victim].) Our decision in
    Sanchez therefore meant that, for the first time, it was no longer
    futile to object to case-specific expert basis testimony that was
    not excessive, inflammatory, or confusing.
    For the reasons stated above, we conclude that the Court
    of Appeal improperly found that Chavez forfeited his claim on
    appeal based upon Sanchez by failing to object at a trial
    occurring before Sanchez was decided. The Court of Appeal here
    reached the same conclusion as People v. Blessett (2018) 
    22 Cal.App.5th 903
    , 925–941. We disapprove Blessett to the extent
    that it is inconsistent with this decision.
    17
    PEOPLE v. PEREZ
    Opinion of the Court by Groban, J.
    III. DISPOSITION
    The judgment of the Court of Appeal is reversed, and the
    cause remanded for further proceedings consistent with this
    opinion.
    GROBAN, J.
    We Concur:
    CANTIL-SAKAUYE, C. J.
    CHIN, J.
    CORRIGAN, J.
    LIU, J.
    CUÉLLAR, J.
    KRUGER, J.
    18
    See next page for addresses and telephone numbers for counsel who argued in Supreme Court.
    Name of Opinion People v. Perez
    __________________________________________________________________________________
    Unpublished Opinion
    Original Appeal
    Original Proceeding
    Review Granted XXX 
    22 Cal.App.5th 201
    Rehearing Granted
    __________________________________________________________________________________
    Opinion No. S248730
    Date Filed: February 27, 2020
    __________________________________________________________________________________
    Court: Superior
    County: San Bernardino
    Judge: John M. Tomberlin
    __________________________________________________________________________________
    Counsel:
    Raymond Mark DiGuiseppe, under appointment by the Supreme Court, for Defendant and Appellant Jose
    Luis Perez.
    Rebecca P. Jones, under appointment by the Supreme Court, for Defendant and Appellant Edgar Ivan
    Chavez Navarro.
    Randall Bookout, under appointment by the Supreme Court, and Henry Russell Halpern for Defendant and
    Appellant Pablo Sandoval.
    Kamala D. Harris and Xavier Becerra, Attorneys General, Edward DuMont, State Solicitor General, Gerald
    A. Engler, Chief Assistant Attorney General, Julie L. Garland, Assistant Attorney General, Michael R.
    Johnsen and Joshua Patashnik, Deputy State Solicitors General, Scott C. Taylor and Kristen Kinnaird
    Chenelia, Deputy Attorneys General, for Plaintiff and Respondent.
    Counsel who argued in Supreme Court (not intended for publication with opinion):
    Rebecca P. Jones
    3549 Camino del Rio S., Suite D
    San Diego, CA 92108
    (619) 269-7872
    Joshua Patashnik
    Deputy Solicitor General
    455 Golden Gate Avenue, Suite 11000
    San Francisco, CA 94102-7004
    (415) 510-3896