Ray v. Wal-Mart ( 2015 )


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  •                  This opinion is subject to revision before final
    publication in the Pacific Reporter
    
    2015 UT 83
    IN THE
    SUPREME COURT OF THE STATE OF UTAH
    SHAWN H. RAY, GABRIEL M. STEWART, LORI POULSEN,
    DEREK HOLT, and ERIC HUNTER,
    Appellants,
    v.
    WAL-MART STORES, INC.,
    Appellee.
    No. 20130940
    Filed September 17, 2015
    On Certification from the United States District Court
    for the District of Utah
    No. 1:11-cv-104
    Attorneys:
    Lorraine P. Brown, Dennis A. Gladwell, Ogden, for appellants
    Kathleen W. Toth, James E. Ji, Salt Lake City, for appellee
    CHIEF JUSTICE DURRANT authored the opinion of the Court, in which
    JUSTICE DURHAM, JUSTICE PARRISH, and JUDGE VOROS joined.
    ASSOCIATE CHIEF JUSTICE LEE filed a dissenting opinion.
    Due to his retirement, JUSTICE NEHRING, did not participate herein;
    COURT OF APPEALS JUDGE J. FREDERIC VOROS sat.
    JUSTICE DENO G. HIMONAS became a member of the Court on
    February 13, 2015, after oral argument in this matter, and
    accordingly did not participate.
    CHIEF JUSTICE DURRANT, opinion of the Court:
    Introduction
    ¶1 Under the at-will employment doctrine, an employer            has
    broad discretion to manage its workforce and may, accordingly,      fire
    an employee for any reason not prohibited by law. But there         are
    several exceptions to at-will employment, including when             an
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    employee‘s termination violates a clear and substantial public policy
    of the State of Utah. In this case, several employees1 of Wal-Mart
    Stores, Inc. (Wal-Mart) were involved in physical confrontations
    with shoplifting customers and were ultimately fired for violating
    company policy. Wal-Mart‘s policy requires employees to disengage
    and withdraw from potentially violent situations. The Employees
    sued Wal-Mart in federal district court for wrongful termination,
    arguing that terminating a person‘s employment for exercising self-
    defense in the workplace violates Utah public policy. The district
    court concluded that their argument raised an issue of first
    impression under Utah law—whether the right of self-defense is the
    type of public policy that provides an exception to the at-will
    employment doctrine. Accordingly, it certified the following
    question of law to us: ―Is the right of self-defense a substantial public
    policy exception to the at-will employment doctrine that provides
    the basis for a wrongful discharge action?‖
    ¶2 We conclude that the policy favoring the right of self-
    defense is a public policy of sufficient clarity and weight to qualify as
    an exception to the at-will employment doctrine. But we limit the
    exception to situations where an employee reasonably believes that
    force is necessary to defend against an imminent threat of serious
    bodily harm and the employee has no opportunity to withdraw.
    Background
    ¶3 This case arises out of two separate incidents involving Wal-
    Mart employees and shoplifters.2 Each of the Employees was tasked
    with, among other things, investigating, documenting, and
    preventing the theft of merchandise by customers and employees
    from Wal-Mart stores. The Employees were fired for violating Wal-
    Mart‘s Policy AP-09, which provides,
    If the Suspect is believed to possess a weapon, the
    Suspect must not be approached. If during an approach
    or investigation, it becomes apparent that the Suspect
    has a weapon or brandishes or threatens use of a
    1We refer to the employees collectively as the ―Employees,‖ but
    we also refer to them individually as needed.
    2 We note that the district court was presented with a third
    incident but dismissed the plaintiff‘s claim arising out of that
    incident because the plaintiff did ―not come forward with facts that
    would allow a reasonable jury to grant him relief.‖ Accordingly, we
    do not recite this incident in our recounting of the facts.
    2
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                            Opinion of the Court
    weapon, all associates must disengage from the
    situation, withdraw to a safe position, and contact law
    enforcement.
    If at any point the Suspect or any other [sic] involved
    becomes violent, disengage from the confrontation,
    withdraw to a safe position and contact law
    enforcement.
    ¶4 The first incident involved plaintiffs Derek Holt and Eric
    Hunter, who were employed at Wal-Mart‘s West Valley City, Utah
    store. Mr. Holt and Mr. Hunter confronted a shoplifter. When the
    shoplifter tried to run away, they grabbed her arms. During the
    ensuing struggle, the shoplifter pulled out a small pocketknife and
    shouted that she was going to stab Mr. Holt and Mr. Hunter if they
    did not let go. Mr. Holt and Mr. Hunter maintained their hold,
    however, and a customer helped pry the knife out of the shoplifter‘s
    hand. Wal-Mart terminated Mr. Holt‘s and Mr. Hunter‘s
    employment for violating Policy AP-09.
    ¶5 The second incident involved plaintiffs Shawn Ray, Lori
    Poulsen, and Gabriel Stewart, who were employed at Wal-Mart‘s
    Layton, Utah store. Several employees at that store, including
    Mr. Ray and Ms. Poulsen, approached a customer who was
    attempting to steal a laptop by concealing it in his pants and escorted
    him to the store‘s asset protection office, where they were joined by
    Mr. Stewart. There is some discrepancy regarding what happened
    next. According to Wal-Mart, the customer placed the laptop on a
    desk and stated, ―You have your laptop, I am now going to leave,
    and I have something I am not supposed to have.‖ Ms. Poulsen saw
    the customer move a gun from his back to his coat pocket. A
    physical struggle ensued, resulting in the Wal-Mart employees
    pinning the customer against a wall and grabbing the gun.
    ¶6 The Employees‘ account of the incident differs somewhat.
    According to them, after the customer removed the laptop from his
    pants he said, ―I have something I shouldn‘t have. Don‘t make me do
    this!‖ Ms. Poulsen noticed the customer had a gun and yelled ―Gun!
    Hand!‖ The customer rushed towards the door but then turned and
    shoved Mr. Stewart against the wall and pressed the gun to his back.
    A skirmish resulted, and the Wal-Mart employees managed to
    remove the gun from the customer‘s hands and force him to the
    ground. Ultimately, Mr. Ray, Ms. Poulsen, and Mr. Stewart were all
    fired following the incident for violating Policy AP-09.
    ¶7 The Employees filed suit against Wal-Mart claiming that
    their terminations were in violation of Utah public policy. Wal-Mart
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    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    filed a motion for summary judgment, which the federal district
    court granted in part by dismissing all of the Employees‘ causes of
    action other than their claim for wrongful termination in violation of
    public policy. With respect to that claim, the court certified to us the
    question of whether self-defense is a substantial public policy
    exception to the at-will employment doctrine, thus providing a basis
    for a wrongful termination action. For purposes of certifying the self-
    defense question, the federal district court asked us to assume that
    the Employees were unable to safely disengage from the incidents.3
    Standard of Review
    ¶8 ―When a federal court certifies a question of law to this
    court, we are not presented with a decision to affirm or reverse . . .
    [and thus] traditional standards of review do not apply.‖4 Rather,
    ―we answer the legal questions presented without resolving the
    underlying dispute.‖5
    Analysis
    ¶9 The question presented in this case is whether in Utah the
    right of self-defense embodies the type of clear and substantial
    public policy that qualifies as an exception to the at-will employment
    doctrine, and thus provides the basis for a wrongful discharge claim.
    The Employees contend that Utah law reflects a clear and substantial
    public policy favoring the right of self-defense, as evidenced by
    various legislative and constitutional provisions that protect the
    right. And they argue that the public policy interests in favor of self-
    defense outweigh an employer‘s competing interests where an
    employee faces an imminent threat of death or serious bodily harm
    and has no opportunity to withdraw.
    3  Specifically, as to the first incident, the court assumed that
    ―Mr. Holt and Mr. Hunter were acting according to Wal-Mart‘s
    procedures when they initially grabbed [the shoplifting customer]
    and that they were unable to let go of her after they became aware
    that she had a knife without a legitimate and reasonable fear that
    they would be stabbed.‖ And as for the second incident, the court
    assumed that ―Mr. Ray, Ms. Poulsen, and Mr. Stewart were unable
    to safely disengage from [the customer] after he pulled out his gun in
    the closed office.‖
    4Touchard v. La-Z-Boy Inc., 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 2, 
    148 P.3d 945
    (internal
    quotation marks omitted).
    5 Garza v. Burnett, 
    2013 UT 66
    , ¶ 9, 
    321 P.3d 1104
    (internal
    quotation marks omitted).
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                               Opinion of the Court
    ¶10 In contrast, Wal-Mart argues that although Utah law evinces
    a policy favoring the right of self-defense, there is no evidence that
    the policy extends to the workplace. It further argues that even if
    there is such a public policy, it is not of sufficient public importance
    to qualify as an exception to at-will employment, because self-
    defense provides a purely private benefit to the person exercising the
    right. And finally, Wal-Mart argues that any public policy interest
    favoring self-defense is outweighed by an employer‘s countervailing
    interests in maintaining ―de-escalation, non-confrontation[,] and
    workplace violence policies‖ and discouraging employee
    vigilantism.
    ¶11 Although we acknowledge that Wal-Mart‘s interest in
    regulating its workforce is important, we conclude that there is a
    clear and substantial public policy in Utah favoring the right of self-
    defense for three reasons. First, the right of self-defense is enshrined
    in Utah statutes, the Utah Constitution, and our common law
    decisions. Second, a policy favoring the right protects human life and
    deters crime, conferring substantial benefits on the public. And third,
    the public policy supporting the right of self-defense outweighs an
    employer‘s countervailing interests in circumstances where an
    employee reasonably believes that force is necessary to defend
    against an imminent threat of serious bodily injury and the
    employee has no opportunity to withdraw. Accordingly, we answer
    the certified question in the affirmative and hold that Utah law
    reflects a policy favoring the right of self-defense, and that policy is
    of sufficient magnitude to qualify as a substantial public policy
    exception to the at-will employment doctrine, but only under the
    narrow circumstances where an employee cannot withdraw and
    faces imminent serious bodily injury.
    I. Legal Background
    ¶12 We begin by outlining the relevant legal principles. Under
    Utah law, there is a presumption that all employment relationships
    entered into for an indefinite period of time are at-will.6 At-will
    employment relationships may be terminated by either an employer
    or an employee for any reason other than those prohibited by law.7
    6   Hansen v. Am. Online, Inc., 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 7, 
    96 P.3d 950
    .
    7  
    Id. There are
    other exceptions to at-will employment that are not
    at issue in this case—when ―there is an implied or express agreement
    that the employment may be terminated only for cause or upon
    satisfaction of [some] agreed-upon condition‖ or ―a statute or
    regulation restricts the right of an employer to terminate an
    (Continued)
    5
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    An employer‘s decision to terminate employment is presumed valid
    unless an employee can show, among other things, that ―the
    termination of employment constitutes a violation of a clear and
    substantial public policy.‖8 An at-will employee whose employment
    has been terminated in violation of a clear and substantial public
    policy may sue for wrongful termination.9 In essence, when this
    exception applies, we determine that ―the public interest is so strong
    and the policy so clear and weighty that we should place the policy
    beyond the reach‖ of an at-will employment contract.10
    ¶13 In this context, the definition of public policy is ―much
    narrower than traditional notions of public policy,‖ so as to not
    unduly infringe on an employer‘s discretion in discharging
    employees.11 We have identified four categories of public policies
    that may provide a basis for a wrongful termination claim:
    (i) refusing to commit an illegal or wrongful act, such
    as refusing to violate the antitrust laws; (ii) performing
    a public obligation, such as accepting jury duty;
    (iii) exercising a legal right or privilege, such as filing a
    workers’ compensation claim; or (iv) reporting to a public
    authority criminal activity of the employer.12
    Only the third category—exercise of a legal right or privilege—is at
    issue in this case. We have noted that this category ―poses analytical
    challenges different from, and generally greater than, the others‖
    because ―[t]he analysis of whether the public policy exception
    employee under certain conditions.‖ 
    Id. (internal quotation
    marks
    omitted).
    8   
    Id. (internal quotation
    marks omitted).
    9 See Berube v. Fashion Ctr., Ltd., 
    771 P.2d 1033
    , 1042 (Utah 1989)
    (―Where an employee is discharged for a reason or in a manner that
    contravenes sound principles of established and substantial public
    policy, the employee may typically bring a tort cause of action
    against his employer.‖).
    10 Touchard v. La-Z-Boy Inc., 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 13, 
    148 P.3d 945
    (internal quotation marks omitted).
    11   Rackley v. Fairview Care Ctrs., Inc., 2001 UY 32, ¶ 15, 
    23 P.3d 1022
    .
    Ryan v. Dan’s Food Stores, Inc., 
    972 P.2d 395
    , 408 (Utah 1998)
    12
    (emphasis added) (citations omitted).
    6
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                                Opinion of the Court
    applies to a particular legal right or privilege will frequently require
    a balancing of competing legitimate interests.‖13
    ¶14 But having a legal right or privilege alone does not mean
    that a terminated employee will necessarily have a valid claim for
    wrongful termination. To determine whether the legal right at issue
    reflects the type of clear and substantial Utah public policy that
    qualifies as an exception to the at-will rule, we consider three factors:
    (1) whether the policy at issue is reflected in authoritative sources of
    state public policy,14 (2) whether the policy affects the public
    generally as opposed to the private interests of the employee and the
    employer,15 and (3) whether countervailing policies outweigh the
    policy at issue.16 These factors are conjunctive requirements; to have
    a wrongful termination claim, an employee must demonstrate that
    each factor supports recognizing an exception to at-will
    employment.
    ¶15 A policy is recognized in an authoritative source of state
    public policy if it is ―plainly defined by legislative enactments,
    constitutional standards, or judicial decisions.‖17 With respect to the
    second factor, a policy qualifies as an exception to the at-will rule
    only if it is ―of overarching importance to the public, as opposed to
    the parties only.‖18 And even if the first two factors both favor
    recognizing a policy as an exception to at-will employment, strong
    countervailing policy interests—including the employer‘s interest in
    regulating its workforce—may outweigh them.19 It is therefore
    13   Hansen, 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶¶ 10–11.
    14   Touchard, 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 12.
    15   
    Id. ¶¶ 13–14,
    18.
    16   Hansen, 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶¶ 10–11.
    17   
    Ryan, 972 P.2d at 405
    .
    18 Retherford v. AT & T Commc’ns of the Mountain States, Inc., 
    844 P.2d 949
    , 966 n.9 (Utah 1992).
    19 Touchard, 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 10; see also Hansen, 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 11
    (noting that courts balance ―the interests of the employer to regulate
    the workplace environment to promote productivity, security, and
    similar lawful business objectives, and the interests of the employees
    to maximize access to their statutory and constitutional rights within
    the workplace‖ to determine whether the exercise of a legal right or
    privilege supports a wrongful discharge claim under the public
    policy exception).
    7
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    somewhat rare that a ―policy is so clear and weighty that‖ we
    conclude it should be placed ―beyond the reach of contract.‖20
    ¶16 Having summarized the applicable legal framework, we
    now engage in an analysis under the three factors described above
    and conclude that the right of self-defense reflects the rare type of
    clear and substantial policy that qualifies as an exception to at-will
    employment.
    II. The Policy Favoring the Right of Self-Defense Is of Sufficient
    Magnitude to Qualify as an Exception to At-Will Employment
    ¶17 We conclude that Utah law reflects a policy favoring the
    right of self-defense with a duty to retreat in some circumstances,
    and that policy is of sufficient magnitude to qualify as an exception
    to at-will employment. First, the right of self-defense is plainly
    defined by authoritative sources because it is enshrined in the Utah
    Constitution, the Utah Code, and our common law decisions. But
    those sources do not articulate an absolute right to meet force with
    force; rather, in some circumstances, a person cannot engage in self-
    defense without first making a reasonable effort to withdraw.
    Second, promoting self-defense benefits the public as a whole by
    preserving and protecting human life and preventing the completion
    of crime.
    ¶18 And third, the policy favoring the right of self-defense
    outweighs an employer‘s countervailing interest in regulating the
    workplace. The right is of paramount importance because it allows a
    person to protect against imminent bodily harm or death. And
    although a policy favoring the right of self-defense does restrict an
    employer‘s ability to control the workplace and regulate its property
    to some degree, we hold that such a policy does not preclude an
    employer from maintaining non-confrontation and de-escalation
    policies in situations where an employee has an opportunity to
    safely withdraw or does not face imminent danger.
    A. The Right of Self-Defense is Reflected in Authoritative Sources of
    Utah Public Policy
    ¶19 We will not recognize a public policy as an exception to the
    at-will rule unless it is reflected in authoritative sources of state
    public policy. Accordingly, in prior cases we have examined whether
    a policy is ―plainly defined by legislative enactments, constitutional
    standards, or judicial decisions.‖21 As we explain in more detail
    20   
    Retherford, 844 P.2d at 966
    n.9.
    21   Ryan v. Dan’s Food Stores, Inc., 
    972 P.2d 395
    , 405 (Utah 1998).
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                                  Opinion of the Court
    below, this does not mean that the scope of a particular public policy
    must be coextensive with the statement of positive law upon which
    it is based.22 Rather, we look to each authoritative source that bears
    on the question before us to see if state law reflects an underlying
    public policy ―so substantial and fundamental that there can be
    virtually no question as to [its] importance to the public good.‖23
    ¶20 That standard is met here. The right of self-defense is
    enshrined in the Utah Constitution, Utah‘s self-defense statute, and
    our common law decisions. But as we explain below, Utah law does
    not set forth an absolute right to meet force with force. Rather, the
    relevant authorities recognize instances where individuals have a
    duty to retreat before engaging in self-defense. We first discuss state
    constitutional provisions and then examine the self-defense statute
    and Utah common law decisions.
    1. The Utah Constitution evinces a public policy favoring the right of
    self-defense
    ¶21 ―Our most fundamental and least ephemeral expression of
    public policy are found in the Utah Constitution.‖24 The Employees
    argue that two constitutional provisions support their position that
    there is a ―clear and substantial‖ public policy in favor of self-
    defense. These provisions include article I, sections 1 and 6 of the
    Utah Constitution. We agree with the Employees and conclude that
    both provisions evince a clear and substantial public policy favoring
    the right of self-defense.
    ¶22 First, the language in article I, section 1 unequivocally
    recognizes that ―[a]ll men . . . the inherent and inalienable right to
    enjoy and defend their lives and liberties.‖ The section‘s drafters did
    not place any temporal or geographic restrictions on the scope of
    that right, and there is simply no way to read the text as establishing
    a right of self-defense at an individual‘s home or in public, but not at
    his or her place of business. Nevertheless, Wal-Mart argues that this
    provision cannot provide a basis for recognizing a ―clear and
    substantial‖ public policy in favor of self-defense, because the Utah
    Constitution only protects rights from infringement by state actors.
    The dissent shares Wal-Mart‘s concern, arguing that constitutional
    provisions are ―a problematic source of public policy‖ because they
    22   See infra ¶¶ 53–58.
    23 Rackley v. Fairview Care Ctrs., Inc., 
    2001 UT 32
    , ¶ 18, 
    23 P.3d 1022
    (internal quotation marks omitted).
    24   Hansen v. Am. Online, Inc., 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 12, 
    96 P.3d 950
    .
    9
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    ―preserve[] fundamental rights of citizenship from incursion by the
    government,‖ not provide ―rights in the workplace‖ that insulate
    employees from an employer‘s personnel decisions.25
    ¶23 This argument misapprehends the nature of the at-will
    doctrine. At-will employment and exceptions to it are common law
    rules.26 And such rules, by their very nature, do ―not rest for their
    authority upon any express or positive statute or other written
    declaration.‖27 To be sure, our caselaw tethers the scope of public
    policy exceptions to those policies ―plainly defined‖ by statements of
    positive law. But we have also recognized that this inquiry involves
    ―loo[king] beyond the provision in question to determine whether
    the motivating policy behind it constitutes a clear and substantial
    public policy.‖28 For that reason, it is ―entirely within our province‖
    to recognize public policy exceptions based on constitutional
    provisions and other authoritative sources that do not directly
    regulate employment.29 And as we discuss in more detail below,
    neither must a recognized exception be coextensive with the source
    of positive law upon which it is based.30
    25 Infra ¶¶ 93−94 (emphasis added) (internal quotation marks
    omitted).
    26See, e.g., Touchard v. La-Z-Boy Inc., 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 21, 
    148 P.3d 945
    (noting that ―wrongful discharge is a common law claim‖ and
    concluding that the ―lack of an anti-retaliation provision‖ in the
    Workers‘ Compensation Act ―does not affect this court‘s ability to
    recognize this state‘s public policy for purposes of a wrongful
    discharge cause of action‖); Price v. W. Loan & Sav. Co., 
    100 P. 677
    ,
    680 (Utah 1909) (holding as a matter of contract law that where an
    employment agreement did not specify a term of employment, the
    agreement ―was terminable at will by either party‖).
    27 Egbert v. Nissan Motor Co., 
    2010 UT 8
    , ¶ 16, 
    228 P.3d 737
    (internal quotation marks omitted).
    28   Rackley, 
    2001 UT 32
    , ¶ 23.
    29   See Touchard, 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 21.
    30 See infra ¶¶ 53–58. This does not mean public policy exceptions
    can be conjured up out of whole cloth, however. We have previously
    cautioned that there must be much more than a ―mere hint [of] such
    an underlying policy‖ in the statute, constitutional provision, or
    judicial decision at issue. Rackley, 
    2001 UT 32
    , ¶ 23. And both the
    nature and content of such sources must show that the policy itself is
    ―so substantial and fundamental that there can be virtually no
    (Continued)
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                             Opinion of the Court
    ¶24 For these reasons, the Employees‘ reliance on the Utah
    Constitution is entirely appropriate. Indeed, we have affirmed the
    relevance of constitutional provisions to this issue in almost every
    decision since the public policy exception was first recognized.31 The
    Employees do not claim that Wal-Mart violated article I, section 1.
    Rather, the Employees cite this provision merely to show that the
    Utah Constitution supports the notion that Utah law reflects a state
    public policy in favor of self-defense. For this reason, and based on
    question as to [its] importance for promotion to the public good.‖
    Berube v. Fashion Ctr., Ltd., 
    771 P.2d 1033
    , 1043 (Utah 1989).
    31 Touchard, 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 12 (―A public policy is ‗clear‘ only if
    plainly defined by legislative enactments, constitutional standards,
    or judicial decisions.‖ (internal quotation marks omitted)); Hansen,
    
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 12 (stating that the ―most fundamental and least
    ephemeral expressions of public policy are found in the Utah
    Constitution‖); Rackley, 
    2001 UT 32
    , ¶ 16 (―We have stated that a
    public policy is ‗clear‘ if it is plainly defined by one of three sources:
    (1) legislative enactments; (2) constitutional standards; or (3) judicial
    decisions.‖); Burton v. Exam Ctr. Indus. & Gen. Med. Clinic, Inc., 
    2000 UT 18
    , ¶ 6, 
    994 P.2d 1261
    (―Declarations of public policy can be
    found in constitutions and statutes.‖); Dixon v. Pro Image Inc., 
    1999 UT 89
    , ¶ 31, 
    987 P.2d 48
    (―A public policy is ‗clear‘ only if plainly
    defined by legislative enactments, constitutional standards, or
    judicial decisions.‖ (internal quotation marks omitted)); Ryan, 
    972 P.2d 395
    , 405 (Utah 1998) (―A public policy is ‗clear‘ only if plainly
    defined by legislative enactments, constitutional standards, or
    judicial decisions.‖); Retherford v. AT & T Commc’ns of Mountain
    States, Inc., 
    844 P.2d 949
    , 960 (Utah 1992) (―[O]nly those public
    policies that are ‗clear‘ and ‗substantial‘ and arise from statutes or
    constitutions qualify for vindication through the tort of discharge in
    violation of public policy.‖); Peterson v. Browning, 
    832 P.2d 1280
    , 1282
    (Utah 1992) (―[D]eclarations of public policy can be found in our
    statutes and constitutions.‖); Hodges v. Gibson Prods. Co., 
    811 P.2d 151
    , 165–66 (Utah 1991) (―[T]he public policy that may be the basis
    for a wrongful discharge action should be defined in the first
    instance by legislative enactments and constitutional standards
    which protect the public or promote the public interest.‖ (internal
    quotation marks omitted)); Berube, 
    771 P.2d 1033
    , 1043 (Utah 1989)
    (recognizing that ―public policy‖ can be ―deduc[ed] in the given
    circumstances from constitutional or statutory provisions‖ (internal
    quotation marks omitted)).
    11
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    the unqualified right recognized in section 1‘s text,32 we reject Wal-
    Mart‘s argument and conclude that this provision evidences a public
    policy favoring the right of self-defense.33
    ¶25 Second, article I, section 6 also supports recognition of a
    clear and substantial public policy favoring the right of self-defense.
    That section provides,
    The individual right of the people to keep and bear
    arms for security and defense of self, family, others,
    property, or the state, as well as for other lawful
    purposes shall not be infringed; but nothing herein
    shall prevent the Legislature from defining the lawful
    use of arms.34
    Like article I, section 1, this provision recognizes an ―individual
    right‖ for ―defense of self, family, others, property, or the state,‖ and
    it provides that this right ―shall not be infringed.‖35 And the text
    places no restrictions or qualifications on when or where that right
    may be exercised.
    ¶26 Section 6 also recognizes another right, one for which the
    text does allow the legislature to impose restrictions—the right ―to
    keep and bear arms‖ for self-defense or any other lawful purpose.
    32  The dissent characterizes the right recognized in article I,
    section 1 as ―vague‖ and ―aspirational‖ in ―nature,‖ and concludes
    that without more specificity, we have ―no idea what that right
    entails.‖ Infra ¶ 97. We see no ambiguity in the text—it
    unambiguously recognizes Utah citizens‘ ―inalienable right‖ to
    ―defend their lives.‖ And as we explain below, Utah has recognized
    a right of self-defense with a duty to retreat since statehood. See infra
    ¶¶ 29–34. This is strong evidence that the original meaning of article
    I, section 1 encompasses a right with those basic contours. See Am.
    Bush v. City of S. Salt Lake, 
    2006 UT 40
    , ¶ 51, 
    140 P.3d 1235
    (considering ―[b]oth the common law and statutory law in force at
    the time of the formation of [the Utah] constitution‖ to determine
    what kinds of speech are protected by article I, section 7 of the state
    constitution).
    33  Wal-Mart makes this argument with respect to each
    constitutional and statutory provision discussed below, and in each
    case we reject it for the same reasons we do so here.
    34   UTAH CONST. art. I, § 6.
    35   
    Id. 12 Cite
    as: 
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                              Opinion of the Court
    This section allows the legislature to ―defin[e]‖ what constitutes ―the
    lawful use of arms,‖36 and our legislature has enacted a number of
    restrictions on the use of firearms under this provision.37 But there is
    no language in section 6 that extends the legislature‘s authority to
    impose restrictions on the broader right of self-defense.
    ¶27 Wal-Mart focuses on the legislative restrictions allowed in
    section 6 and argues that we have already determined that the rights
    recognized in that provision are not clear and substantial public
    policies. In support, Wal-Mart cites Hansen v. American Online, Inc.38
    But in that case, we were asked to determine ―whether the right to
    keep and bear arms in Utah is a public policy which is so clear and
    substantial as to supersede an employer‘s attempt to restrict
    weapons in the workplace by contract.‖39 We held that the right did
    not outweigh an employer‘s interests, primarily because ―the
    legislature ha[d] purposefully declined to give the right to keep and
    bear arms absolute preeminence over the right to regulate one‘s own
    private property.‖40 Our opinion was completely silent regarding the
    broader right of self-defense.
    ¶28 Accordingly, we reject Wal-Mart‘s contention that Hansen
    forecloses recognition of a policy in favor of self-defense. And we
    conclude that article I, sections 1 and 6 of the Utah Constitution are
    strong evidence that Utah has a clear and substantial public policy of
    allowing individuals to protect themselves and others from
    imminent harm.
    2. Utah‘s ―Stand Your Ground‖ statute and common law decisions
    also reflect a public policy favoring the right of self-defense
    ¶29 Provisions of the Utah Code similarly support recognition of
    a public policy supporting the right of self-defense. Utah has been a
    ―Stand Your Ground‖ state since 1994.41 Utah Code section 76-2-401
    provides ―a defense to prosecution for any offense‖ if the defendant
    acted to protect himself or others from imminent harm, as described
    36   
    Id. 37 See,
    e.g., Hansen, 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶¶ 15, 23 (discussing Utah statutes
    that restrict the possession and use of firearms).
    38   
    2004 UT 62
    .
    39   
    Id. ¶ 20
    (emphasis added).
    40   
    Id. (emphasis added).
       41   See 1994 Utah Laws 281.
    13
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    in section 402.42 In framing the scope of that right, section 402 allows
    a person to ―threaten[] or us[e] force against another when and to the
    extent that the person reasonably believes that force or a threat of
    force is necessary to defend the person or a third person against . . .
    imminent . . . unlawful force.‖43 The statute further provides that
    there is generally no ―duty to retreat from the force or threatened
    force‖ if the person is located in a place where he or she ―has
    lawfully entered or remained.‖44 But there are exceptions—a person
    may not engage in self-defense if he or she ―was the aggressor or
    was engaged in combat by agreement‖ and made no attempt to
    ―withdraw[] from the encounter.‖45
    ¶30 Like the constitutional provisions discussing the right of
    self-defense, this statute is strong evidence of a state public policy
    favoring self-defense. Of course, the terms of the ―Stand Your
    Ground‖ statute are not unequivocal—a person who is lawfully
    located in a place may have a duty to retreat depending on the
    circumstances. For instance, the statute recognizes a duty to retreat
    where the person exercising self-defense was engaged in combat by
    agreement or was the initial aggressor.46 And a person whose
    presence on another‘s property is not lawful—like a trespasser—is
    not ―in a place where‖ he or she has ―lawfully entered or remained,‖
    and the person must accordingly retreat under the plain terms of the
    statute before exercising the right to self-defense.47
    ¶31 We note, however, that the right described in our self-
    defense statutes and the one recognized in the state constitution do
    not appear to be coextensive. As we have discussed, Utah did not
    become a ―Stand Your Ground‖ state until 1994, and if the
    legislature decided to repeal those provisions of the self-defense
    statute, we see no reason why that would limit the right of self-
    defense recognized in article I, sections 1 and 6 of the Utah
    42   UTAH CODE § 76-2-401(1)(a).
    43   
    Id. § 76-2-402(1)(a).
       44   
    Id. § 76-2-402(3).
       45   
    Id. § 76-2-402(2)(a)(iii),
    -402(3).
    46   
    Id. § 76-2-402(2)(a).
       47Id. § 76-2-402(3); State v. Tuckett, 
    2000 UT App 295
    , ¶ 13, 
    13 P.3d 1060
    (noting that ―[u]pon refusing to leave when asked,‖ a criminal
    defendant ―became a trespasser who had a duty to retreat‖ before
    engaging in self-defense‖).
    14
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                              Opinion of the Court
    Constitution. After all, Utah law has recognized a somewhat
    narrower right of self-defense, which included a duty to withdraw,
    since statehood.48 In other words, ―Stand Your Ground‖ is not the
    constitutional minimum. And for purposes of the public policy
    exception to at-will employment, we construe public policies
    narrowly, protecting ―only those principles which are so substantial
    and fundamental that there can be virtually no question as to their
    importance for promotion of the public good.‖49 So even if the
    ―Stand Your Ground‖ statute absolves someone of criminal liability
    for using force, that does not necessarily mean Utah recognizes a
    48   See REVISED STATUTES OF UTAH § 75-14-4168(3) (1898)
    (―Homicide is also justifiable when committed by any person . . . in
    the lawful defense of such person . . . when there is reasonable
    ground to apprehend a design to commit a felony or to do some
    great bodily injury, and there is imminent danger of such design
    being accomplished; but such person, or the person in whose behalf
    the defense was made, if he was the assailant or engaged in mortal
    combat, must really and in good faith have endeavored to decline any
    further struggle before the homicide was committed . . . .‖ (emphasis
    added)). The Territory of Utah adopted a substantially similar law as
    early as 1876. See COMPILED LAWS OF UTAH tit. VIII, ch. I, § 1926
    (1876).
    The dissent argues that there is ―no meaningful difference‖
    between Utah‘s 1898 self-defense statute and the ―Stand-Your-
    Ground‖ law passed in 1994. Rather, the dissent believes that both
    statutes ―recognize the so-called right to ‗stand your ground‘ as it
    currently stands.‖ Infra ¶ 101 n.155. The dissent is correct that the
    duty to retreat outlined in both statutes is similar. But ―Stand-Your-
    Ground‖ provides that there is no ―duty to retreat‖ from a place
    where an individual ―has lawfully entered or remained,‖ UTAH
    CODE § 76-2-402(3), language that does not appear in the 1898
    statute. Additionally, the 1898 statute is limited to providing a
    justification for certain homicides committed in self-defense, while
    our current statute provides a more general defense that applies to
    any ―use of force.‖ Compare REVISED STATUTES OF UTAH § 75-14-4168
    (1898) (outlining self-defense and defense of others as circumstances
    under which ―[h]omicide is also justifiable‖), with UTAH CODE § 76-2-
    402(1)(a) (providing that an individual ―is justified in threatening or
    using force against another‖ when acting in self-defense or defense
    of others).
    49   Rackley, 
    2001 UT 32
    , ¶ 18 (internal quotation marks omitted).
    15
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    fundamental public policy that encourages that behavior in every
    circumstance permitted by statute.
    ¶32 What our constitution and self-defense statutes do suggest is
    that although Utah recognizes a public policy that strongly supports
    the right of self-defense, that policy also embodies a duty to retreat
    in some circumstances before the right may be exercised. And one
    such circumstance is where an individual‘s right to engage in self-
    defense conflicts with property owners‘ rights to decide who may
    ―lawfully‖ enter or remain in their home or place of business.50
    ¶33 That is not to say employees defending themselves in the
    workplace are on the same footing as a trespasser or someone
    engaged in mutual combat when raising a defense to a criminal
    prosecution or seeking to establish a public policy exception to at-
    will employment. Clearly they are not. Rather, it is simply a
    recognition that authoritative sources of state public policy do not
    plainly define a right of self-defense that is absolute. So to the extent
    the Employees suggest that Utah public policy does not contemplate
    a duty to retreat in the workplace under any circumstances, they are
    mistaken.
    ¶34 This conclusion is also supported by Utah common law.
    Historically, Utah courts have also recognized a broad right of self-
    defense that, depending on the circumstances, may involve a duty to
    retreat before it is exercised. Utah courts have long held that ―a man
    has the same right to defend his place of business against intruders
    as he has to defend his dwelling. He is no more under the necessity
    of retreating in the one instance than in the other when he is being
    assailed.‖51 But like the ―Stand Your Ground‖ statute, our common
    law decisions also recognize circumstances in which a person must
    retreat before engaging in self-defense. For example, as early as 1893,
    we held that trespassers and initial aggressors have a duty to
    retreat.52 In People v. Hite, we approved the following jury instruction
    where a defendant was accused of threatening a homeowner with a
    gun and then killing the homeowner on his front porch during a
    shootout: ―If . . . the defendant went to the house there wrongfully
    . . . for the purpose of a quarrel, and by his own acts put himself in
    that position, . . . it was his duty to retreat . . . and decline any
    50UTAH CONST. art. I, § 1 (recognizing the ―inalienable right . . . to
    acquire, possess, and protect property‖).
    51   State v. Turner, 
    79 P.2d 46
    , 54 (Utah 1938).
    52   People v. Hite, 
    33 P. 254
    , 257 (Terr. Utah 1893).
    16
    Cite as: 
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                              Opinion of the Court
    controversy, if he could with safety.‖53 Otherwise, the defendant
    ―could not justify the homicide on the ground of self-defense.‖54 Our
    caselaw, like the ―Stand Your Ground‖ statute, thus articulates a
    broad right of self-defense that applies at a person‘s home or place of
    business, with a limited duty to retreat, depending on the
    circumstances. These sources are accordingly strong evidence that
    Utah has a clear and substantial public policy favoring the right of
    self-defense.
    ¶35 Wal-Mart nevertheless argues that the ―Stand Your
    Ground‖ statute does not apply here, because the purpose of the
    statute was to protect spouses in situations of domestic abuse, not to
    allow individuals to defend themselves in the workplace. In support,
    Wal-Mart cites several pieces of legislative history that show the
    purpose of the statute was to protect abused spouses from having to
    flee their homes. Specifically, Wal-Mart references a 1994 House Bill
    amending section 76-2-402, which states,
    Section 2. Legislative Intent.
    Amendments made by this act to Section 76–2–402,
    regarding self defense, are intended to clarify that
    justification of the use of force in defense of a person
    applies equally to all persons including victims of
    abuse in ongoing relationships.55
    Additionally, the bill‘s sponsor, Representative Barth, stated that
    we‘ve made it very clear. Remaining in a relationship
    does not constitute combat by agreement. If you‘re a
    victim, it‘s sometimes perceived that it‘s your
    responsibility to leave, to exit your home; but you have
    every right to be there and you are the victim of a
    crime. So we‘ve made it very clear that you have every
    right to be there.56
    ¶36 Wal-Mart‘s argument seems to suggest that we should
    ignore the text of the statute and instead focus on its purpose. As
    authority for this position, it quotes from our decision in Hansen,
    where we stated that we are ―not restricted to parsing statutory text
    53   
    Id. 54 Id.
       55   1994 Utah Laws 281.
    56Utah State House of Representatives, Floor Deb. on H.B. 13,
    50th Utah Leg., Gen. Sess. (Jan. 21, 1994) (Day 5).
    17
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    and may properly look to many sources, including legislative
    history, which may illuminate the dimensions of the public policy at
    issue.‖57 But Wal-Mart‘s argument misinterprets Hansen. Although
    the determination of whether there is clear and substantial public
    policy is not one of traditional statutory interpretation, it certainly is
    not the case that we are at liberty to ignore statutory text. Rather,
    Hansen merely establishes that other sources, in addition to statutory
    text, may evidence a public policy.
    ¶37 Moreover, even if we accept Wal-Mart‘s argument that one
    of the purposes of the ―Stand Your Ground‖ act is to allow spouses
    the option not to retreat, it does not follow that such a purpose is the
    only purpose of the statute. As the House Bill notes, the statute
    ―applies equally to all persons including victims of abuse in ongoing
    relationships.‖58 Nothing in the statement suggests that the statute
    applies exclusively to victims of domestic abuse. And again, the fact
    that the statute‘s text is phrased in terms of general applicability,
    subject to several enumerated exceptions, suggests that its
    application is not limited solely to domestic disputes.
    ¶38 In sum, we conclude that the ―Stand Your Ground‖ statute,
    accompanying statutes that define self-defense, and Utah common
    law decisions evidence a clear and substantial public policy favoring
    the right of self-defense. And coupled with the constitutional
    provisions we have already discussed, we conclude that the right of
    self-defense is plainly defined by authoritative sources of Utah
    public policy. This plainly defined policy explicitly recognizes,
    however, other compelling circumstances in which a person may
    have a duty to retreat. This factor therefore favors recognizing the
    policy underpinning the right of self-defense, which sometimes
    imposes a duty to retreat, as an exception to at-will employment. We
    now turn to the question of whether this policy is of broad public
    importance.
    B. The Right of an Employee to Self-Defense Is of Broad Public Importance
    ¶39 Even if a public policy is reflected in the Utah Constitution,
    the Utah Code, and our common law decisions, it is not clear and
    substantial unless it is ―of overarching importance to the public, as
    opposed to the parties only.‖59 Otherwise, we will not find that ―the
    57   Hansen, 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 15 n.7.
    58   1994 Utah Laws 281.
    59   
    Retherford, 844 P.2d at 966
    n.9.
    18
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                              Opinion of the Court
    public interest is so strong and the policy so clear and weighty that
    we should place the policy beyond the reach of contract.‖60 To
    determine whether the exercise of a legal right or privilege is of
    overarching importance to the public, we examine whether the right
    confers a benefit on the public or ―inures solely to the benefit of the
    employer and employee.‖61 Where the legislature has prohibited
    private parties from waiving the right or privilege by contract, there
    is strong evidence that the right reflects a clear and substantial public
    policy,62 though we may nevertheless recognize a policy exception in
    the absence of such a clear statutory prohibition.63 In this case,
    because the right of self-defense protects human life and deters
    crime, we conclude that the right is a matter of broad public
    importance, not merely an internal matter of employer-employee
    relations.
    ¶40 A policy favoring the right of self-defense preserves and
    protects human life. And society places great value on safety and the
    preservation of human life. In part, this is because the doctrine of
    self-defense encapsulates the doctrine of defense of others. Under
    Utah law, ―[a] person is justified in threatening or using force against
    another when and to the extent the person reasonably believes that
    force or threat of force is necessary to defend the person or a third
    person against another person‘s imminent use of unlawful force.‖64
    Our law therefore reflects the common law principle that an ―actor is
    privileged to defend a third person from‖ harm ―under the same
    conditions and by the same means as those under‖ which he ―is
    privileged to defend himself.‖65 A state policy favoring the right of
    self-defense therefore protects individuals from serious injuries and
    deters the completion of crime. Even Wal-Mart concedes that the
    60   
    Id. 61 Touchard,
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 13.
    62See 
    id. ¶¶ 13,
    16 (noting that because the legislature prohibits
    workers from waiving their workers‘ compensation rights by
    contract, such rights reflect a clear and substantial public policy).
    63 See, e.g., Heslop v. Bank of Utah, 
    839 P.2d 828
    , 837–38 (Utah 1992)
    (holding that the reporting requirements under the Utah Financial
    Institutions Act amounted to a clear and substantial public policy
    even though the act does not expressly mention whether parties can
    contract around these obligations).
    64   UTAH CODE § 76-2-402(1) (emphasis added).
    65   RESTATEMENT (SECOND) OF TORTS § 76 (1965).
    19
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    public likely receives at least indirect benefits from the exercise of
    this important right.
    ¶41 For these reasons, we agree with the Employees that the
    doctrine of self-defense and defending others furthers the public
    good, rather than simply conferring benefits on private parties. We
    therefore conclude that this factor weighs in favor of recognizing the
    right of self-defense as an exception to the at-will rule.
    ¶42 The dissent argues that self-defense is not a matter of
    overarching importance to the public, but rather a ―private matter,‖
    providing individuals with ―a defense from criminal liability‖ for
    ―aggressive activity that would otherwise be criminal.‖66 And the
    dissent maintains that for a policy to be of broad public importance,
    it must ―redound unquestionably to the public good.‖67 In other
    words, it must implicate a right upon which ―the employer has no
    legitimate ground for intervening.‖68 And the dissent concludes that
    because the right of self-defense is not ―an unmitigated good,‖
    employers have legitimate interests in limiting it, and the right
    therefore does not confer sufficient benefits on the public to qualify
    as a clear and substantial public policy.69
    ¶43 We concede the right of self-defense may not meet the
    standard the dissent articulates. But that standard is not the one
    articulated in our caselaw to determine whether a particular legal
    right or privilege is of overarching importance to the public. The
    dissent cites Hansen v. America Online, Inc. for the proposition that
    the exercise of a legal right must be one upon which the employer
    ―has no legitimate economic ground for intervening.‖70 The Hansen
    court employed that concept, however, to highlight why a public
    policy exception based on the ―exercis[e of] a legal right or privilege‖
    requires an additional analytical step compared to the other
    categories of public policy exceptions we have recognized.71 That is,
    even where a legal right appears plainly defined in authoritative
    sources and confers substantial benefits on the public at large, a
    court must still balance the ―competing legitimate interests‖ of the
    66   Infra ¶ 109.
    67   Infra ¶¶ 111–16.
    68   Infra ¶ 111.
    69   Infra ¶¶ 111–12 (citing Hansen, 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 10).
    70   Infra ¶ 111 (citing Hansen, 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 10).
    71   See Hansen, 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶¶ 9–10.
    20
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                              Opinion of the Court
    employer and employee to determine whether the right supports a
    wrongful discharge claim.72 The ―legitimate economic ground‖
    language had nothing to do with determining whether a legal right
    qualifies as a matter of broad public importance.
    ¶44 In Hansen, we noted that our caselaw recognizes four
    categories of public policy exceptions to at-will employment: (1)
    refusing to commit an illegal or wrongful act, (2) performing a public
    obligation, (3) exercising a legal right or privilege, and (4) reporting
    to a public authority criminal activity of the employer.73 We
    observed that the first two categories are exceptions to the at-will
    rule because an employer ―owes a duty to an employee . . . not to
    exploit the employment relationship by demanding that an
    employee choose between continued employment and violating a
    law or failing to perform a public obligation of clear and substantial
    import.‖74 And this is because ―the extortionate use of termination to
    coerce an employee to commit unlawful acts or avoid public
    obligations serves no legitimate economic objective and corrodes civil
    society.‖75
    ¶45 In contrast, where an employer asks an employee to waive
    ―a legal right or privilege, even a right or privilege which carries
    strong public policy credentials,‖ we noted that the employee will
    not be exposed ―to possible criminal penalties or other legal
    sanctions.‖76 So such claims will often involve ―a balancing of
    competing legitimate interests: the interests of the employer to
    regulate the workplace environment . . . and the interests of the
    employees to maximize access to their statutory and constitutional
    rights within the workplace.‖77
    ¶46 Thus, the language in Hansen the dissent cites indicates
    when courts must balance the competing interests of the employee
    and the employer. It does not speak to whether a legal right or
    privilege implicates a matter of broad public importance. So even
    though employers have legitimate economic reasons to limit the
    conditions under which their employees may engage in self-defense,
    72   See 
    id. ¶ 11.
       73   
    Id. ¶ 9.
       74   
    Id. ¶ 10.
       75   
    Id. (emphasis added).
       76   
    Id. ¶ 11.
       77   
    Id. 21 RAY
    v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    that does not alter our conclusion that the right is of overarching
    importance to the public. Instead, it requires that our analysis not
    end with the conclusion that the right of self-defense is both plainly
    defined in authoritative sources and a matter of broad public
    importance. We must then carefully balance the Employees‘ interest
    in exercising that right against Wal-Mart‘s interest in regulating its
    workforce and private property. It is that question to which we now
    turn.
    C. The Right of Self-Defense Outweighs the Countervailing Interest of
    Wal-Mart to Regulate the Workplace
    ¶47 Having concluded that the first two factors weigh in favor of
    recognizing the right of self-defense as a clear and substantial public
    policy exception to at-will employment, we now turn to the third
    factor: whether the public policy outweighs employers‘ interest in
    being able ―to manage their workforces and regulate their workplace
    environments to promote productivity, security, and similar lawful
    business objectives.‖78 Wal-Mart argues that self-defense does not
    outweigh employers‘ interest in maintaining a safe workplace
    through non-confrontation and de-escalation policies. Additionally,
    it claims that our decision in Hansen already weighed these
    competing policies in employers‘ favor and that virtually every
    jurisdiction to decide the issue has refused to recognize a self-
    defense exception to at-will employment. We reject these arguments
    and conclude that employers‘ interests do not outweigh the right of
    individuals to defend themselves. But because the public policy
    reflected in Utah self-defense law recognizes a duty to retreat in
    some circumstances, and because Wal-Mart has strong interests in
    regulating its workforce and property, our decision is limited to
    circumstances in which an employee faces an imminent threat of
    serious bodily harm and has no opportunity to withdraw.
    ¶48 Wal-Mart maintains that Utah has a strong public policy in
    favor of de-escalation and non-confrontation policies that outweighs
    an employee‘s right of self-defense. In support, Wal-Mart cites to a
    number of sources. For instance, the Utah Occupational Safety and
    Health Agency found that ―[b]ehavioral strategies for workplace
    violence prevention suggest training employees in nonviolent
    response and conflict resolution.‖79 The Utah Code also requires that
    78Touchard, 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 17, 
    148 P.3d 945
    (internal quotation
    marks omitted).
    79UTAH OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH AND SAFETY DIVISION, UOSH
    SAFETY LINE NEWSLETTER (Nov. 2010), available at http://laborcommi
    (Continued)
    22
    Cite as: 
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                             Opinion of the Court
    ―employer[s] . . . furnish to each of [their] employees . . . a place of
    employment that [is] free from recognized hazards that are causing
    or are likely to cause death or physical harm.‖80 Moreover, multiple
    federal agencies, such as the Occupational Safety and Health
    Administration and the National Institute for Occupational Safety
    and Health, have recommended that employers maintain policies
    requiring non-resistance during robberies, as well as training in
    nonviolent response.81 Wal-Mart argues that its Policy AP-09 is in
    line with such recommendations.
    ¶49 These policies are undoubtedly important, and Wal-Mart
    argues that recognizing a public policy exception for the right of self-
    defense ―would obliterate employers‘ ability‖ to implement them. In
    particular, it claims that because self-defense is a factually intensive
    issue, employers will never be certain if they can terminate an
    employee without facing a possible wrongful termination lawsuit.
    Employees will then be able to flout de-escalation policies with
    impunity because the benefits to the employer of enforcing these
    policies will not outweigh the likely cost of litigating the wrongful
    termination claims of every employee terminated for failing to
    follow them. As a result, Wal-Mart argues, employers may scrap de-
    escalation and non-confrontation policies altogether.
    ssion.utah.gov/media/pdfs/uosha/pubs/newsletters/newsletters2
    010/112010 Safety Line.pdf (last visited Aug. 13, 2015).
    80   UTAH CODE § 34A-6-201(1).
    81    OCCUPATIONAL     SAFETY AND HEALTH ADMINISTRATION,
    RECOMMENDATIONS FOR WORKPLACE VIOLENCE PREVENTION
    PROGRAMS IN LATE-NIGHT RETAIL ESTABLISHMENTS (OSHA 3153-12R),
    at            11              (2009),           available           at
    https://www.osha.gov/Publications/osha3153.pdf (last visited
    Aug. 13, 2015) (recommending that workplace safety training should
    include ―[s]pecific instructions on how to respond to a robbery such
    as turning over money or valuables without resistance‖); THE
    NATIONAL INSTITUTE FOR OCCUPATIONAL SAFETY AND HEALTH,
    PREVENTING HOMICIDE IN THE WORKPLACE (PUB. NO. 93-109) (May
    1995), available at http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/docs/93-109 (last
    visited Aug. 13, 2015) (stating that preventative measures to reduce
    workplace homicides include ―[p]rovid[ing] training in conflict
    resolution and nonviolent response [and] . . . [a]void[ing] resistance
    during robbery‖).
    23
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    ¶50 We agree with Wal-Mart that employers have a strong
    interest in preventing employees from using force in the workplace,
    even in self-defense. To some extent, by requiring trespassers to
    retreat before engaging in self-defense, Utah law recognizes the
    importance of allowing business owners to regulate access to and
    use of their property.82 As Wal-Mart points out, this interest is also
    recognized in statutes and regulations at both the state and federal
    level. And Wal-Mart‘s argument that employers will be subject to
    expensive litigation if employees are allowed to exercise self-defense
    is particularly weighty.
    ¶51 But ultimately, we believe that the public policy favoring the
    right of self-defense outweighs these interests, at least in the narrow
    circumstances presented in this case. For purposes of certifying the
    question in this case to us, the federal district court assumed that all
    the Employees were ―unable to safely disengage‖ from a threat of
    violence. In such circumstances, the employee faces the prospect of
    severe injury or death with no opportunity to withdraw. Under
    Utah‘s ―Stand Your Ground‖ statute and Utah‘s common law
    decisions, even an initial aggressor or trespasser who makes a good
    faith effort to flee may still engage in self-defense if there is no
    opportunity to safely withdraw.83 The law should not require
    employees to choose between keeping their jobs and protecting
    themselves or others from a serious, imminent threat of harm. And
    in light of the impressive constitutional and statutory pedigree the
    right of self-defense enjoys in our state,84 we hold that Utah law does
    not require employees to make that choice. Consequently, where an
    at-will employee is unable to withdraw from an imminent threat of
    death or serious bodily harm, the employer may not terminate the
    employee for exercising the right of self-defense. And employees
    fired for defending themselves in such circumstances may bring a
    wrongful termination claim against their employer.
    ¶52 In so holding, we note that Wal-Mart‘s policy may be
    consistent with the clear and substantial public policy exception we
    82   See supra ¶¶ 27–30.
    83 See UTAH CODE § 76-2-402(2)(a)(iii), (3); People v. Hite, 
    33 P. 254
    ,
    257 (Terr. Utah 1893) (―If it appears from the evidence . . . that the
    defendant went to the house there wrongfully . . . it was his duty to
    retreat from that, and decline any controversy, if he could with
    safety. He was not bound to run away, and take a shot in the back.‖).
    84   See supra ¶¶ 21–28, 29–31.
    24
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                                   Opinion of the Court
    recognize today. Policy AP-09 explicitly allows employees to
    ―defend themselves or others to the extent necessary to disengage
    the Suspect, withdraw from the situation and contact law
    enforcement.‖ Although it does not say so explicitly, this language
    implies that an employee who had no opportunity to ―disengage‖
    and ―withdraw from the situation‖ would be entitled to defend
    themselves. Further, there is no reason why Wal-Mart and other
    employers cannot continue to train their employees to disengage and
    withdraw from dangerous situations when there is no imminent
    threat of serious bodily injury or a reasonable opportunity to
    withdraw—in such a situation, we hold that an employer‘s interest
    in regulating its workforce and property outweighs employees‘
    interest in defending themselves without fear of being terminated.
    ¶53 The dissent raises two primary objections to this conclusion,
    arguing that (1) the public policy we recognize is ―not the right
    enshrined in our law,‖ but a ―new one, tailored to the employment
    context‖ that is unsupported by any of our ―cited authorities,‖85 and
    (2) our ruling is premised largely on an inappropriate assumption
    that the Employees were unable to withdraw.86 We address each of
    these arguments in turn.
    ¶54 The dissent‘s first argument is inconsistent with the way we
    have applied the doctrine since its inception. As we have discussed,
    at-will employment and exceptions to it are common law rules that
    do not depend on statutes or other statements of positive law for
    their authority.87 For that reason, public policy exceptions need not
    be coextensive with the statutes or constitutional provisions upon
    which they are based.88
    85   Infra ¶¶ 91, 92, 95.
    86   Infra ¶¶ 82, 117–22.
    87   See supra ¶ 23.
    88 See, e.g., Hansen, 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 15 n.7 (noting that in analyzing
    whether a public policy is plainly defined in authoritative sources of
    Utah law, ―the issue before us is not one of statutory interpretation,‖
    so ―the centerpiece of our inquiry is the strength and scope of public
    policy‖ and ―our efforts to assay this question‖ are accordingly ―not
    restricted to parsing statutory text‖); Rackley, 
    2001 UT 32
    , ¶ 10 (―We
    agree with plaintiff that if we were to require the law to be so
    specifically tailored, the public policy exception would be
    meaningless.‖).
    25
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    ¶55 For example, in Peterson v. Browning, we held that a private
    employer could not terminate an employee for refusing to violate state
    tax law and federal customs law.89 In support, we cited the Utah
    Protection of Public Employees Act, which protects public
    employees from being discharged for ―reporting a violation of a law,
    or rule promulgated under the law of this state, a political
    subdivision of this state, or any recognized entity of the United
    States.‖90 We noted that even though ―the statute does not
    specifically limit the rights of private employers or address the
    employer who directs an employee to engage in unlawful conduct,‖
    it reflected ―legislative approval of the basic proposition that it is
    against the public policy of the state for employers to discharge
    employees who seek to act within the law.‖91
    ¶56 Similarly, in Heslop v. Bank of Utah,92 we recognized a public
    policy exception based on a statute that said nothing about the
    employer-employee relationship. In that case, we held that a bank
    employee could not be terminated for making an internal report
    about the bank‘s noncompliance with state reporting requirements.93
    The authoritative source we relied on to ―plainly define‖ the public
    policy at issue was section 7-1-318 of the Utah Financial Institutions
    Act, which ―makes failure or refusal to submit accurate and timely
    call reports‖ to state regulators ―a third degree felony.‖94 But nothing
    in the Act prohibited an employer from firing someone for reporting
    a violation, and none of its provisions regulated the employee-
    employer relationship in any respect.95
    ¶57 More recently, in Touchard v. La-Z-Boy Inc., we rejected a
    company‘s argument that the lack of an anti-retaliation provision in
    the Workers‘ Compensation Act precluded us from crafting a public
    policy exception that would prevent employers from firing workers
    for seeking workers‘ compensation benefits.96 We noted that because
    
    89 832 P.2d at 1283
    .
    90 
    Id. at 1281
    n.2 (emphasis added) (internal quotation marks
    omitted).
    91   Id.
    92   
    839 P.2d 828
    .
    93   
    Id. at 838.
       94   
    Id. at 837.
       95   See UTAH CODE § 7-1-318.
    96   
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 21.
    26
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                               Opinion of the Court
    ―wrongful discharge is a common law claim,‖ the absence of such a
    provision ―does not affect this court‘s ability to recognize this state‘s
    public policy for purposes of a wrongful discharge cause of action.‖97
    We then held that Utah law reflects a clear and substantial public
    policy prohibiting employers from terminating a worker for seeking
    benefits guaranteed by the Act.98
    ¶58 In two of these cases, we recognized public policy
    exceptions based on statutes that did not regulate employment. And
    in all three, the scope of each exception exceeded the statement of
    positive law upon which it was based. So to the extent the dissent
    suggests that public policy exceptions must be coextensive with
    statements of positive law, that assertion is inconsistent with the
    nature of the doctrine as well as our holdings in several cases.
    ¶59 Moreover, if employees could rely only on those sources
    that explicitly regulate the employment relationship to establish a
    public policy exception, it would render the public policy exception
    effectively meaningless. For almost two decades, we have
    recognized three ways an employee can rebut the presumption of at-
    will employment:
    (1) there is an implied or express agreement that the
    employment may be terminated only for cause or upon
    satisfaction of [some] agreed-upon condition; (2) a
    statute or regulation restricts the right of an employer
    to terminate an employee under certain conditions; or
    (3) the termination of employment constitutes a
    violation of a clear and substantial public policy.99
    If the only statutes that qualify as an authoritative source of public
    policy are those that directly regulate the employee-employer
    relationship, it seems likely that many of them would be statutes that
    ―restrict[] the right of an employer to terminate an employee under
    certain conditions.‖100 Consequently, limiting our analysis to only
    those sources of law that directly regulate employment would
    require us to overrule much of our precedent in this area of the law.
    97   
    Id. 98 Id.
    ¶ 19.
    99 Hansen, 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 7 (internal quotation marks omitted);
    accord Touchard, 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 3; Fox v. MCI Commc’ns Corp., 
    931 P.2d 857
    , 859 (Utah 1997).
    100   See Touchard, 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 3.
    27
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    ¶60 The dissent next argues that our ruling is the result of how
    we have ―frame[d]‖ the question.101 In particular, the dissent
    believes our assumption ―that the Employees were unable to safely
    disengage‖ is ―not an element of the question certified for our
    review,‖ but rather ―an outgrowth of the summary judgment
    posture of the case as it currently stands.‖102 And because the dissent
    thinks it likely that none of the Employees in this case and very few
    in future cases would be fired under circumstances where they were
    unable to withdraw form imminent harm, the dissent would leave it
    to employers to decide whether employees were justified in
    defending themselves.103
    ¶61 This argument is unpersuasive for two reasons. First,
    because this case requires us to answer a certified question, there is
    no need to ―frame‖ the question ourselves; the federal district court
    has already done that for us. And our opinion simply quotes the
    legal question put to us by the federal district court along with the
    factual circumstances it asked us to assume for purposes of
    answering that question.
    ¶62 The district court‘s order of certification frames the question
    as follows: ―Is the right of self-defense a substantial public policy
    exception to the at-will employment doctrine, which provides the
    basis for a wrongful discharge action?‖ And the order references the
    court‘s memorandum decision, which includes a section entitled,
    ―Facts Assumed to Be True for Certification.‖ The district court notes
    that there is a factual dispute about whether the Employees could
    safely withdraw, but ―before a jury may resolve these disputed
    factual issues, the court must first ascertain that there is a legal basis
    on which the Plaintiffs may proceed. Accordingly, the court assumes
    for purposes of certifying the self-defense question to the Utah
    Supreme court‖ that the Employees ―were unable to safely
    disengage.‖ So even if the dissent is correct that these assumed facts
    represent an ―outlier case,‖104 it is nevertheless the case squarely
    presented to us by the certified question. And moreover, this
    101   Infra ¶ 80.
    102   Infra ¶ 81.
    103   Infra ¶¶ 82 n.140, 82–83, 116–20.
    104   Infra ¶ 119.
    28
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                                 Opinion of the Court
    practice—of presenting a state court with assumed facts for purposes
    of answering a certified question—is a standard one.105
    ¶63 Second, the dissent allows speculation about what a jury
    might decide drive its analysis of the certified question. Even if it is
    likely, as the dissent maintains, that Wal-Mart will ultimately prove
    that the Employees ―fought back unnecessarily,‖106 this is a decision
    appropriately left to the jury. The dissent acknowledges that ―we do
    not know exactly what happened in the confrontations that led to the
    wrongful termination claims against Wal-Mart,‖107 and that our
    ―approach might make sense in a case in which it is undisputed that
    an employee has no possible means of withdrawal.‖108 But rather
    than simply accept the facts the federal district court asked us to
    assume for purposes of certification, the dissent argues that ―the
    record on summary judgment supports the conclusion that Wal-
    Mart made a reasonable judgment in concluding that its employees
    fought back when they could have reasonably disengaged‖109 and
    concludes that this ―is easily enough to defeat the public policy basis
    for a claim for wrongful termination in this case.‖110 We leave this
    question to the jury. And far from ―loading the dice in favor‖ of the
    Employees,111 we are merely making the assumptions the district
    court has asked us to make, rather than venturing into speculation.
    ¶64 When presented with a certified question, our role is to
    simply ―answer the legal questions presented without resolving the
    underlying dispute.‖112 It is certainly true, as the federal district
    court acknowledged, that the Employees ―may fail to convince a jury
    105 See, e.g., Stone v. Smith, Kline & French Labs., 
    447 So. 2d 1301
    ,
    1301–03 (Ala. 1984); Wash. Metro. Area Transit Auth. v. Johnson, 
    726 A.2d 172
    , 173–74 (D.C. 1999); Canal Elec. Co. v. Westinghouse Elec.
    Corp., 
    548 N.E.2d 182
    , 184 (Mass. 1990); Horn v. S. Union Co., 
    907 A.2d 691
    , 691 (R.I. 2006) (mem.).
    106   Infra ¶ 118.
    107   Infra ¶ 83.
    108   Infra ¶ 82 n.140.
    109   Infra ¶ 83.
    110   Infra ¶ 83.
    111   Infra ¶ 82.
    112 Iverson v. State Farm Mut. Ins. Co., 
    2011 UT 34
    , ¶ 8, 
    256 P.3d 222
    (internal quotation marks omitted).
    29
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    of these facts, and therefore Wal-Mart may win its case even if the
    Plaintiffs are allowed to proceed on their self-defense theory.‖ But
    such a determination is one for a future federal jury to make, not this
    court. The dissent‘s approach would therefore allow speculation
    about what a jury might find drive our answer to the certified
    question, which inappropriately steps in to the jury‘s role and
    ignores the federal district court‘s explicit request that we assume
    certain facts to be true for purposes of resolving unsettled issues of
    state law.
    ¶65 Moreover, in holding otherwise, we are not resolving any
    underlying factual disputes or ―loading the dice‖ in favor of
    employees; we are letting them have their day in court to prove a
    claim the dissent acknowledges ―makes sense‖ in circumstances
    where ―an employee has no possible means of withdrawal.‖ By
    contrast, the dissent‘s approach would simply trust employers to
    make the appropriate decision on whether an employee acted in
    reasonable self-defense or retaliation, and the dissent asserts ―[i]t
    would be the rare employer . . . who would actually fire an employee
    for defending himself in the face of a threat of ‗severe injury or death
    with no opportunity to withdraw.‘‖113 That may or may not be true.
    But speculation about employers‘ personnel decisions is not relevant
    to deciding whether self-defense is the kind of clear and substantial
    public policy that qualifies as an exception to the at-will rule.114
    ¶66 Finally, we note that our decision today is consistent with
    persuasive authority from other jurisdictions. Wal-Mart maintains
    that virtually every jurisdiction to consider the issue has determined
    that employers‘ rights to manage their workforce and create a safe
    environment outweigh employees‘ right of self-defense. And it urges
    us to adopt the reasoning in these decisions. In support, it cites cases
    113   Infra ¶ 118.
    114 The dissent characterizes our holding as prohibiting ―the
    matter addressed by Wal-Mart‘s de-escalation policy‖ from being ―a
    proper subject of voluntary contract.‖ See infra ¶ 84 n.143. This
    overstates the scope of our holding. Employees may only raise the
    public policy exception we recognize today when they have no
    opportunity to withdraw from serious imminent harm. As we have
    discussed, nothing in our decision today prohibits employers from
    requiring their employees to disengage from violent situations when
    they have such an opportunity. See supra ¶ 52.
    30
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                                Opinion of the Court
    from Pennsylvania,115 Maryland,116 North Carolina,117 and two
    federal district courts.118 The courts in each case declined to
    recognize a self-defense exception to at-will employment.119 But
    several of these cases are distinguishable, and we find the reasoning
    of another case from West Virginia120 more persuasive.
    ¶67 The policy-weighing analysis in both the Maryland case and
    the federal district court decisions are distinguishable because they
    involve a much more expansive view of self-defense than the
    Employees assert in this case. The plaintiffs in these cases articulated
    a right of self-defense that encompassed instances where employees
    used force in retaliation or in circumstances where there was an
    opportunity to withdraw. In Bagwell v. Peninsula Regional Medical
    Center, the Maryland Court of Special Appeals concluded that an
    employee terminated by a hospital could not base a wrongful
    termination claim on the fact that she was fired for defending
    115 Scott v. Extracorporeal, Inc., 
    545 A.2d 334
    , 342–43 (Pa. Super. Ct.
    1988) (refusing to recognize a self-defense exception to at-will
    employment because ―the public policy asserted by appellant—the
    right to exercise self-defense—strikes entirely too near the
    employer‘s legitimate interest in discharging employees it perceives
    to be disruptive‖).
    116   Bagwell v. Peninsula Reg’l Med. Ctr., 
    665 A.2d 297
    , 312–13 (Md.
    1995).
    117McLaughlin v. Barclays Am. Corp., 
    382 S.E.2d 836
    , 840 (N.C. Ct.
    App. 1989) (declining to recognize a self-defense exception to at-will
    employment because the court did ―not perceive‖ any substantial
    ―deleterious consequences for the general public‖).
    118Hoven v. Walgreen Co., No. 1:11-cv-881, 
    2012 WL 6025790
    , at *5
    (W.D. Mich. Dec. 4, 2012) (dismissing cause of action for wrongful
    determination where an employee fired a gun during an attempted
    robbery, because the constitutional provisions and statutes upon
    which the plaintiff relied ―are not directed at conferring rights on
    employees‖ (internal quotation marks omitted)); Johnson v. CVS
    Pharmacy, Inc., No. C 10-03232, 
    2011 WL 4802952
    , at *5 (N.D. Cal.
    Oct. 11, 2011) (declining to recognize a self-defense public policy
    exception to at-will employment because the ―state courts in
    California‖ had not ―authoritatively establish[ed]‖ such a claim).
    119   See supra nn. 115–18.
    120   Feliciano v. 7-Eleven, Inc., 
    559 S.E.2d 713
    (W. Va. 2001).
    31
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    herself.121 But the court also noted that ―all the evidence‖ in the case
    ―points to the conclusion‖ that the hospital fired the employee
    because it believed she ―acted in retaliation,‖ not self-defense.122
    Similarly, in Johnson v. CVS Pharmacy, five employees were fired
    after physical altercations and name-calling throughout the day
    culminated in a brawl at the back of the store.123 The Northern
    District of California held that the employees did not have a
    wrongful discharge claim and expressed reluctance ―to recognize
    such [wrongful termination claim], at least on the facts here.‖124
    ¶68 The competing policies in Bagwell and Johnson differ in
    important ways from the policies at issue here. In each case, the
    plaintiffs articulated a right of self-defense that extended to
    situations where employees used force in retaliation or in
    circumstances where it would have been safe to withdraw and
    contact law enforcement. And the courts ultimately determined that
    the relative benefits of such a broad right of self-defense were
    outweighed by the employers‘ countervailing interests. Here, by
    contrast, the certified question requires us to assume that the
    Employees acted to defend themselves and had no opportunity to
    escape. So the manner in which the courts in those cases weighed the
    competing policy concerns is not particularly instructive on how we
    should weigh de-escalation and non-confrontation policies against a
    much narrower right of self-defense.
    ¶69 The other federal district court case Wal-Mart cites also
    involves a much broader right of self-defense. In Hoven v. Walgreen
    Co., the Western District of Michigan concluded that a pharmacist
    who was terminated for firing a gun during an armed robbery could
    not maintain a wrongful termination claim.125 The court noted that
    Michigan law places restrictions on the possession and use of
    firearms in the workplace, so the plaintiff could not argue that
    Michigan law evinces a public policy supporting his conduct.126 But
    here, none of the Employees used a firearm.
    
    121 665 A.2d at 312
    .
    122   
    Id. at 313.
       123   
    2011 WL 4802952
    , at *1–*2.
    124   
    Id. at *5.
       125   
    2012 WL 6025790
    , at *1, *4–*5.
    126   
    Id. at *5.
    32
    Cite as: 
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                               Opinion of the Court
    ¶70 The other cases Wal-Mart cites are on point, but as we
    discuss in more detail below, we find the reasoning from a West
    Virginia case to be more persuasive. Decisions in Pennsylvania and
    North Carolina express skepticism that the judiciary should be
    involved in deciding whether an employee was justifiably
    terminated for using force in the workplace. In Scott v. Extracorporeal,
    Inc., an employee was fired after a coworker knocked her
    unconscious, even though the employee ―either acted in self-defense
    or never landed a blow.‖127 The Pennsylvania Superior Court
    concluded that recognizing a self-defense exception to at-will
    employment ―would have the unwise effect of transferring to the
    judicial forum the duty of evaluating the propriety of management
    decisions.‖128 Similarly, in McLaughlin v. Barclays American Corp., the
    Court of Appeals of North Carolina affirmed the dismissal of a
    manager‘s wrongful discharge cause of action where the manager
    accidentally hit an employee who was attacking him.129 The court
    reasoned that recognizing a self-defense exception to at-will
    employment would allow ―every employee involved in an
    altercation‖ to ―assert a self-defense justification, spawning [a] . . .
    deluge‖ of wrongful termination litigation.130
    ¶71 As we have already noted, these concerns are not
    unwarranted. But we weigh the relevant policy concerns differently,
    as did the Supreme Court of West Virginia in Feliciano v. 7-Eleven,
    Inc. In that case, a cashier was fired after she disarmed a robber and
    restrained him until law enforcement arrived.131 Somewhat similar to
    Wal-Mart‘s Policy AP-09, 7-Eleven‘s policy prohibited ―employees
    from subduing or otherwise interfering with a store robbery.‖132
    While acknowledging that employers have ―an interest in protecting
    [their] staff and customers from harm that may befall them as a
    result of the employee‘s actions in defending him/herself,‖133 the
    West Virginia Supreme Court concluded that self-defense was the
    type of clear and substantial public policy that qualified as an
    
    127 545 A.2d at 335
    , 342.
    128   
    Id. at 343
    (internal quotation marks omitted).
    
    129 382 S.E.2d at 837
    –38, 840.
    130   
    Id. at 840.
       
    131 559 S.E.2d at 716
    –17.
    132   
    Id. at 716.
       133   
    Id. at 722.
    33
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    Opinion of the Court
    exception to at-will employment.134 But because of the ―very real
    possibility‖ that employees may harm coworkers or innocent
    bystanders when exercising the right of self-defense, the court
    limited the public policy exception to instances where an employee
    responds to ―lethal imminent danger.‖135
    ¶72 Wal-Mart attempts to distinguish Feliciano by claiming that
    the result was driven by idiosyncratic feature of West Virginia law.
    Specifically, Wal-Mart refers to the West Virginia Supreme Court‘s
    statement that the right of self-defense had previously been
    recognized to extend to one‘s place of employment in its prior
    caselaw: ―In defending himself, his family or his property from the
    assault of an intruder, one is not limited to his immediate home or
    castle; his right to stand his ground in defense thereof without
    retreating extends to his place of business also.‖136 Wal-Mart
    maintains that Utah common law recognizes no such right. But in
    fact, our precedent mirrors West Virginia law on this issue. We have
    stated that ―a man has the same right to defend his place of business
    against intruders as he has to defend his dwelling. He is no more
    under the necessity of retreating in the one instance than in the other
    when he is being assailed.‖137 Feliciano is therefore directly on point,
    and its reasoning supports the decision we reach today.
    ¶73 In sum, we conclude that an individual‘s right of self-
    defense outweighs an employers‘ interest in regulating its workforce
    and property through de-escalation and non-confrontation policies.
    Thus, this factor weighs in favor of recognizing the state policy
    supporting this important right as the kind of clear and substantial
    public policy that qualifies as an exception to the at-will employment
    doctrine. And because the other two factors also support recognition
    of such an exception, we answer the certified question in the
    affirmative—an employee may maintain a wrongful termination
    claim against an employer where the employee is fired for engaging
    in self-defense, but only if the employee faced an imminent threat of
    serious bodily harm under circumstances where he or she was
    unable to safely withdraw.
    134   
    Id. at 722–23.
       135   
    Id. at 723.
       136   
    Id. at 722
    (quoting State v. Laura, 
    116 S.E. 251
    (W. Va. 1923)).
    137   State v. Turner, 
    79 P.2d 46
    , 54 (Utah 1938).
    34
    Cite as: 
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                            A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    Conclusion
    ¶74 We conclude that Utah law recognizes a policy favoring the
    right of self-defense, and that policy is the kind of clear and
    substantial public policy that qualifies as an exception to the at-will
    employment doctrine. Accordingly, an at-will employee who is fired
    for exercising that right may maintain a wrongful termination action,
    but only if the employee faced an imminent threat of serious bodily
    harm in circumstances where he or she was unable to withdraw. We
    so hold because (1) Utah law strongly supports the right of self-
    defense while recognizing circumstances in which a person may
    have a duty to withdraw; (2) a policy favoring the right of self-
    defense is also of broad public importance because it protects human
    life while deterring crime; and (3) despite the strong interests
    employers have in maintaining a safe workplace through de-
    escalation policies, the right of individuals to defend themselves
    against imminent bodily injury or death is simply more compelling
    where the employee cannot safely withdraw. We therefore answer
    the certified question in the affirmative.
    ASSOCIATE CHIEF JUSTICE LEE, dissenting:
    ¶75 Wal-Mart Stores has adopted a policy of non-resistance for
    employees confronted with workplace violence. The policy directs
    Wal-Mart associates to ―disengage‖ and ―withdraw‖ when
    confronted with a weapon. It also reserves their right to ―defend
    themselves or others‖—but only ―to the extent necessary‖ to
    disengage.
    ¶76 Wal-Mart‘s policy follows recommendations of the
    Occupational Safety and Health Administration and the National
    Institute for Occupational Safety and Health. See supra ¶ 48. Those
    organizations, and doubtless many others, recommend that workers
    receive training in ―how to respond to a robbery‖ by ―turning over
    money or valuables without resistance.‖138 The Wal-Mart
    138   OCCUPATIONAL     SAFETY & HEALTH ADMINISTRATION,
    RECOMMENDATIONS FOR WORKPLACE VIOLENCE PREVENTION
    PROGRAMS IN LATE-NIGHT RETAIL ESTABLISHMENTS (OSHA 3153-12R),
    at 11 (2009); see also NAT‘L INST. FOR OCCUPATIONAL SAFETY &
    DISEASE, PUB. NO. 93-109: PREVENTING HOMICIDE IN THE WORKPLACE,
    CDC.GOV            (May          1995),        available           at
    http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/docs/93-109/                    (discussing
    recommended preventive measures aimed at reducing workplace
    homicides, including ―[p]rovid[ing] training in conflict resolution
    (Continued)
    35
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    approach—of disengagement and withdrawal—appears to be a
    fairly standard practice in retail establishments throughout the
    country.139
    ¶77 Where, as here, the workers in question are at-will
    employees, the Wal-Mart policy includes a further (implied)
    element: The employer has the final say in the event of disagreement
    as to whether the employee was engaged in proper self-defense or
    prohibited escalation, and a concomitant right to terminate the
    employee if it decides that the policy was violated.
    ¶78 The question presented concerns the enforceability of the
    foregoing arrangement. That question, in my view, is not simply
    whether Utah law favors a right of self-defense. It is whether an
    employment agreement along the lines outlined above—with a
    worker‘s duty to withdraw when confronted with a weapon, a right
    of self-defense when withdrawal is not reasonably possible, and the
    employer retaining the final say on whether the policy was
    followed—is a matter where our state ―public interest is so strong
    and the policy so clear and weighty that we should place the policy
    beyond the reach‖ of a voluntary contract. Touchard v. La-Z-Boy Inc.,
    
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 13, 
    148 P.3d 945
    (emphasis added) (internal quotation
    marks omitted).
    ¶79 I would uphold the viability of Wal-Mart‘s policy under that
    standard. Thus, I would conclude that Utah‘s public interest in
    preserving a right of self-defense is insufficient to override Wal-
    Mart‘s legitimate interests in holding its workers to the policy at
    issue.
    ¶80 The majority frames the question differently. It asks whether
    our public policy sustains a right to maintain a wrongful termination
    claim where ―the employee faced an imminent threat of serious
    bodily harm in circumstances where he or she was unable to safely
    withdraw.‖ Supra ¶ 73. And it roots that formulation in the fact that
    the federal district court ―assume[d] that the Employees were unable
    to safely disengage‖ from the confrontations they faced. Supra ¶ 7.
    and nonviolent response [and] [a]void[ing] resistance during
    robbery‖).
    139 See, e.g., Hoven v. Walgreen Co., 
    751 F.3d 778
    , 781 (6th Cir. 2014)
    (challenge to Walgreen Co.‘s de-escalation policy); Feliciano v. 7-
    Eleven, Inc., 
    559 S.E.2d 713
    , 716 (W. Va. 2001) (challenge to 7-Eleven‘s
    policy prohibiting employees from interfering with a store robbery).
    36
    Cite as: 
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                             A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    ¶81 That assumption, however, is not an element of the question
    certified for our review. It is an outgrowth of the summary judgment
    posture of the case as it currently stands. The certified question
    presented is whether the ―right of self-defense‖ sustains a ―public
    policy exception to the at-will employment doctrine that provides a
    basis for a wrongful discharge action‖ in this case. In analyzing that
    question, we cannot properly assume that the employees in question
    ―reasonably believe[d] that force [was] necessary to defend against
    an imminent threat of serious bodily harm and . . . ha[d] no
    opportunity to withdraw.‖ Supra ¶ 2. Our role in answering certified
    questions is ―not to issue abstract, advisory opinions on general
    matters of interest to the federal courts.‖ Fundamentalist Church of
    Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints v. Horne, 
    2012 UT 66
    , ¶ 8, 
    289 P.3d 502
    . ―It is to resolve disputed questions of state law in a context and
    manner useful to the resolution of a pending federal case.‖ 
    Id. To do
    so, we have not only a right but a responsibility to frame the
    question presented in a manner ―facilitating the disposition of the
    underlying federal case.‖ 
    Id. ¶ 9.
       ¶82 At this stage of the case, we do not know whether the
    employee-plaintiffs responded reasonably to an imminent threat or
    overreacted in the face of a meaningful path for retreat. I would not
    resolve that doubt by reference to the summary judgment posture of
    the case (which yields the benefit of the doubt to the nonmoving
    parties). That move ends up loading the dice in favor of what I see as
    the less likely scenario in this and in the broad run of cases. Instead, I
    would take a step back and frame the question presented in more
    general terms—of whether an express agreement to give the
    employer the final say in the event of factual disagreement is a
    matter where our state public policy is so clear and weighty that we
    should place the matter beyond the reach of a voluntary contract.140
    140 The majority‘s approach might make sense in a case in which
    it is undisputed that an employee has no possible means of
    withdrawal. In that event—in a case in which an employee is fired
    for refusing to take a bullet for his pacifist employer—I could
    understand the court‘s notion that the employer‘s interests are
    outweighed by our public policy favoring self-defense. See
    McLaughlin v. Barclays Am. Corp., 
    382 S.E.2d 836
    , 840 (N.C. Ct. App.
    1989) (rejecting public policy basis for wrongful termination claim in
    a case in which the employer made a good faith determination that
    the employee‘s act of self-defense was not necessary under the
    circumstances, while leaving open the possibility that a valid claim
    could be made in a case in which the employer‘s decision could be
    (Continued)
    37
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    ¶83 While the federal district court assumed that the employees
    faced an imminent threat and had no opportunity to withdraw in
    light of the summary judgment posture of the case, the reality is that
    we do not know exactly what happened in the confrontations that
    led to the wrongful termination claims against Wal-Mart. And at a
    minimum, the record on summary judgment supports the
    conclusion that Wal-Mart made a reasonable judgment in concluding
    that its employees fought back when they reasonably could have
    disengaged.141 For me that is easily enough to defeat the public
    policy basis for a claim for wrongful termination in this case.142
    shown to have been made in bad faith). But such a case seems
    terribly unlikely. In most every case in which an employee is fired
    for fighting back, I suspect it will be because the employer
    reasonably believes that the employee‘s response was
    unreasonable—that disengagement and withdrawal were reasonably
    possible, and that the worker‘s response was therefore unnecessary.
    Cf. Margaret Raymond, Looking for Trouble: Framing and the Dignitary
    Interest in the Law of Self-Defense, 71 OHIO ST. L.J. 287, 293 (2010)
    (observing that ―[s]elf-defense cases‖ in criminal law ―rarely reflect‖
    simple, easy-to-discern facts, but are usually ―complex and
    ambiguous‖ as to the intentions and actions of the parties).
    That (usual) circumstance is one in which the employer‘s interests
    easily outweigh the employee‘s. Even the majority concedes that
    point. See supra ¶¶ 15, 18. Yet the court‘s holding—allowing an
    employee to file a wrongful termination claim to seek to establish the
    reasonableness of any act of self-defense in the workplace—seems
    tailored to the opposite (unusual) circumstance.
    141 As the majority acknowledges, the shoplifter who confronted
    Derek Holt and Eric Hunter ―pulled out a small pocketknife and
    shouted that she was going to stab [them] if they did not let go.‖ Supra
    ¶ 4 (emphasis added). Yet Holt and Hunter ―maintained their
    hold . . . and a customer helped pry the knife out of the shoplifter‘s
    hand.‖ Supra ¶ 4. In so doing they were at least arguably in direct
    violation of Wal-Mart‘s policy. The shoplifter‘s statement is not an
    unconditional threat of violence. It is a conditional threat—a ―money
    or your life [or limb]‖ offer. And this is precisely the circumstance
    that Wal-Mart‘s policy is aimed at—at directing its associates to turn
    over merchandise instead of fighting back, in an effort to minimize
    the risk of workplace violence.
    The incident involving Shawn Ray, Lori Poulsen, and Gabriel
    Stewart is a bit more ambiguous. As the court notes, the employees‘
    version of what happened is different from Wal-Mart‘s. But again
    (Continued)
    38
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                            A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    ¶84 I recognize that these are matters in dispute. And I concede
    that under our criminal law of self-defense, the employee-plaintiffs
    there is good reason to believe that Wal-Mart‘s policy was violated.
    Under either version of the facts, the shoplifter‘s reference to his gun
    seems to be a plea to allow him to walk away with the laptop—again
    with a conditional threat of violence. Even under the employees‘
    account of the confrontation, the shoplifter made a vague reference
    to his gun and said ―Don‘t make me do this!‖ Under Wal-Mart‘s
    policy, the proper response to that reference would have been to
    withdraw and disengage. But, even according to the employees, they
    confronted the shoplifter—with Poulsen‘s shout of ―Gun! Hand!‖
    and an ensuing physical skirmish. See supra ¶ 6. That was at least
    arguably a breach of Wal-Mart‘s policy, which understandably
    required the Wal-Mart associates to disengage and let the shoplifter
    walk away with the laptop when he displayed or made reference to
    a gun.
    142 The point of this discussion is not to ―speculat[e] about what a
    jury might decide‖ in resolving the certified question. Supra ¶ 63. It
    is to assess a key aspect of the state law question as I understand it—
    which is whether the arrangement Wal-Mart has with its employees
    is a matter that must be placed beyond the reach of contract. If we
    can identify routine applications of the Wal-Mart policy in which the
    employee has a legal right of self-defense but the employer may
    reasonably prefer withdrawal, it seems easy to conclude that this is a
    proper matter for voluntary agreement (and, accordingly, not a
    proper case for a public policy basis for a right to sue for wrongful
    termination). That is the point of the above discussion.
    The federal court‘s contrary ―assumption‖ about the facts is not a
    finding, or even an acceptance of the employees‘ allegations. It is just
    a reflection of the procedural posture of the case. We should, of
    course, acknowledge that posture. But if we were evaluating these
    employee-plaintiffs‘ right to sue for wrongful termination on their
    motion for summary judgment, I would not conclude that they
    would eventually succeed in proving that they were unable to safely
    disengage. I would acknowledge the reality that the answer to that
    question is uncertain. And I would take that reality into account in
    concluding that it is reasonable for an employer to adopt a
    workplace de-escalation policy like Wal-Mart‘s—or at least not so
    unreasonable that we can conclude that state policy is ―so strong and
    the policy so clear and weighty that we should place the policy
    beyond the reach‖ of a voluntary contract. Touchard v. La-Z-Boy Inc.,
    
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 13, 
    148 P.3d 945
    (internal quotation marks omitted).
    39
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    were fully justified in their response to the violence they faced in the
    workplace. But that is not the issue before us.143 The question, rather,
    is whether our public policy of self-defense is sufficient to override
    the right of an employer and employee to agree to give the employer
    the final say in case of doubt about the reasonableness of an
    employee‘s act of self-defense in the workplace. That is the
    arrangement Wal-Mart entered into with its associates—under
    Policy AP-09, when read against the presumption of at-will
    employment. And that arrangement seems perfectly reasonable to
    me, particularly given the high stakes—and substantial risk—
    inherent in the contrary approach.
    ¶85 In resolving the matter the other way, the majority
    jeopardizes the ability of employers to adopt and enforce workplace
    violence policies like the one adopted by Wal-Mart (and countless
    other retailers). By ruling that employees have a right to assert
    wrongful termination claims in cases where they disagree with their
    employer‘s assessment of the reasonableness of a response to
    workplace violence, the majority assures that a substantial
    percentage of doubtful cases will be resolved in favor of the
    143 My approach is not aimed at ―step[ping] in to the jury‘s role‖
    or at ―speculat[ing] about what a jury might find‖ in this case. Supra
    ¶ 64. It is to consider the facts of this case in answering the question
    of state law that is presented. That question requires us to ask
    whether Wal-Mart‘s de-escalation policy is a matter that can
    properly be resolved by voluntary agreement with its associates.
    I am not proposing to resolve a disputed question of fact. On
    summary judgment, however, it is entirely appropriate for a court to
    ask whether there is a legal barrier to a plaintiff‘s claim that may
    deprive the plaintiff of a right to present the case to a jury. And the
    background facts are entirely ―relevant to deciding whether self-
    defense is the kind of clear and substantial public policy that
    qualifies as an exception to the at-will rule.‖ Supra ¶ 65. The
    majority, in fact, considers them too. It just does so behind the veil of
    the summary judgment assumption that the employee-plaintiffs in
    this case could not safely disengage. Ultimately, the court concludes
    that the matter addressed by Wal-Mart‘s de-escalation policy is not a
    proper subject of voluntary contract. And that decision, at least
    implicitly, is premised on the notion that employees are sufficiently
    likely to have a right of self-defense that outweighs the employer‘s
    interest in workplace safety. So both opinions are making
    assumptions. Neither of us are treating the underlying facts as ―not
    relevant.‖ See supra ¶ 65.
    40
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                             A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    employee. That will be the inevitable effect of the employee‘s right to
    sue. Wrongful termination suits are costly, and the threat of such a
    suit accordingly gives the employee substantial leverage. That
    leverage will make it harder for Utah employers to get their
    employees to follow their workplace violence policies on a day-to-
    day basis.144 And the Utah workplace will inevitably be less safe as a
    result. 145 I dissent from the court‘s conclusion that the public policy
    of the State of Utah requires this troubling result.
    144 See Feliciano v. 7-Eleven, Inc., 
    559 S.E.2d 713
    , 724 (W. Va. 2001)
    (Maynard, J., dissenting) (―[T]he new substantial public policy
    exception to the employment at will doctrine renders no-fighting
    policies unenforceable as well. Now every time an employee is
    discharged for fighting, he or she will sue his or her employer and
    claim self-defense. The majority opinion will have the unfortunate
    result of taking disciplinary decisions out of the hands of private
    employers and placing these decisions in the court.‖). I recognize
    that the court‘s holding does not formally ―prohibit[] employers from
    requiring their employees to disengage from violent situations when
    they have the opportunity.‖ See supra ¶ 65 n.114. But it will have that
    practical effect, as a result of the leverage inherent in the employee‘s
    right to sue.
    145 See, e.g., Rebecca K. Yau et al., Does Employee Resistance During
    a Robbery Increase the Risk of Customer Injury? 57 J. OCCUPATIONAL &
    ENVTL. MED. 417, 417 (2015) (concluding that employee resistance
    increases the likelihood of injury by 160%); Corinne Peek-Asa et al.,
    Employee and Customer Injury During Violent Crime in Retail and
    Service Businesses, 96 AM. J. PUB. HEALTH 1867, 1869 & tbl. 2 (2006)
    (concluding that ―[r]esisting the perpetrator of the crime was
    consistently related to increased risk of injury for both employees
    and customers, and the risk was higher for robberies than for all
    other violent crimes combined‖); Kathryn Brown Schaffer et al., A
    Case-Site/Control-Site Study of Workplace Violent Injury,           44 J.
    OCCUPATIONAL & ENVTL. MED. 1018, 1018 (2002) (noting studies that
    identified ―employee resistance during a robbery‖ as ―contribut[ing]
    to an increased risk of injury‖); Kimberly A. Faulker et al., Robbery
    Characteristics and Employee Injuries in Convenience Stores, 40 AM. J.
    INDUST. MED. 703, 705, 706 & tbl.II (2001) (concluding from data set
    that ―[i]njury rates were highest among employees who resisted‖);
    see also 
    Feliciano, 559 S.E.2d at 725
    –26 (Maynard, J., dissenting) (―It is
    clear to me that recognizing self-defense as a substantial public
    policy exception to the employment at will doctrine is not only
    (Continued)
    41
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    ¶86 Today‘s decision jeopardizes employee safety in Utah. And
    it opens the door to a free-wheeling, case-by-case public policy
    exception that threatens to swallow the rule of at-will employment.
    ¶87 I respectfully dissent on three grounds. First, I find no
    support for the right of self-defense as formulated by the majority in the
    constitutional, statutory, and common law sources it cites. Second, I
    cannot conclude that the manner of an individual‘s exercise of the
    right of self-defense is a matter of ―overarching importance to the
    public as opposed to the parties only.‖ Touchard, 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 17
    (internal quotation marks omitted). Finally, I do not believe that the
    public interest in the manner of an individual‘s exercise of the right
    of self-defense outweighs the interests of Wal-Mart in ―regulat[ing]
    the workplace environment to promote . . . security.‖ Hansen v.
    America Online, Inc., 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 11, 
    96 P.3d 950
    .
    I
    ¶88 For many decades our common law has embraced the
    presumption that employment in Utah is ―at will,‖ meaning that it
    may be terminated by either party for any reason or for no reason.146
    This is no arbitrary presumption. It is the expression of a
    longstanding state policy—that our economy in general, and labor
    markets in particular, will be enhanced by a system of employment
    that is flexible and generally unencumbered by litigation.147
    unnecessary but will do more harm than good. It is likely to increase
    the chance of physical altercations between employees and robbers,
    which, in turn, will result in injuries to employees and customers
    . . . .‖).
    146  E.g., Hansen v. Am. Online, Inc., 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 7, 
    96 P.3d 950
    (―Utah‘s employment law presumes that all employment
    relationships entered into for an indefinite period of time are at-will,
    where the employer or the employee may terminate the employment
    for any reason (or no reason) except where prohibited by law.‖).
    147   RICHARD A. POSNER, ECONOMIC ANALYSIS OF LAW 342–43 (6th
    ed. 2003) (concluding that at-will employment is economically
    efficient and noting that ―outside of the unionized sector . . . and
    government employment . . . , employment at will is the usual form
    of labor contract in the United States,‖ and lamenting that ―[d]espite
    its efficiency properties,‖ courts are turning the at-will presumption
    ―into a de facto requirement of showing good cause for firing a
    worker‖); Richard A. Epstein, In Defense of the Contract At Will, 51 U.
    CHI. L. REV. 947, 950 (1984) (―The flexibility afforded by the contract
    (Continued)
    42
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                             A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    ¶89 Any individual faced with an unforeseen job loss will
    inevitably bristle at the imposition of the at-will presumption. But
    our law has long embraced the principle that overall, and across the
    broad run of employment disputes, we will be better off with a
    system that eschews drawn-out disputes in favor of a policy of
    letting bygones be bygones.148
    ¶90 The presumption is rebuttable. But our law has placed strict
    limits on the means of rebuttal. Where the basis for rebuttal is in a
    violation of public policy, we have required that the policy be ―clear
    and substantial,‖ Hansen v. America Online, Inc., 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 7, 
    96 P.3d 950
    , or in other words ―so clear and weighty that we should
    place the policy beyond the reach‖ of voluntary agreement. Touchard
    v. La-Z-Boy Inc., 
    2006 UT 71
    ¶13, 
    148 P.3d 945
    (internal quotation
    marks omitted). The applicable public policy, moreover, must be in
    positive statements of law. 
    Id. ¶ 12
    (―A public policy is ‗clear‘ only if
    plainly defined by legislative enactments, constitutional standards,
    or judicial decisions.‖ (internal quotation marks omitted)). And it
    must affect a matter of ―overarching importance to the public as
    opposed to the parties only,‖ and clearly ―outweigh‖ the employer‘s
    interest in regulating the workplace. 
    Id. ¶¶ 10,
    13 (internal quotation
    marks omitted). In my view the employee-plaintiffs‘ claims fail at
    every turn under this framework.
    A
    ¶91 The majority concludes that Utah law upholds a ―clear and
    substantial public policy favoring the right of self-defense.‖ Supra
    at will permits the ceaseless marginal adjustments that are necessary
    in any ongoing productive activity conducted, as all activities are, in
    conditions of technological and business change.‖); Mayer G. Freed
    & Daniel D. Polsby, Just Cause for Termination Rules and Economic
    Efficiency, 38 EMORY L.J. 1097, 1097–99, 1144 (1989) (noting that, ―in
    the absence of unions, employment is almost always at will‖ even
    though parties are free to agree otherwise, and concluding that at-
    will employment is an efficient economic arrangement for labor
    markets and that ―replacing the at-will rule with some form of
    governmental review of dismissal decisions will be costly‖).
    148 See Epstein, supra note 147, at 982 (―The strength of the
    contract at will [doctrine] should not be judged by the occasional
    cases in which it is said to produce unfortunate results, but rather by
    the vast run of cases where it provides a sensible private response to
    the many and varied problems in labor contracting.‖).
    43
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    ¶ 38. Yet the right that it ultimately endorses is not the right
    enshrined in our law. It is a new one, tailored to the employment
    context. Specifically, in place of the ―stand-your-ground‖ right
    protected by statute and longstanding caselaw, the court announces
    a more narrow right—a right to fight back only if you are ―unable to
    withdraw from an imminent threat of death or serious bodily harm.‖
    Supra ¶ 57.
    ¶92 I dissent from the court‘s analysis because none of its cited
    authorities establish this right of self-defense. The court‘s common
    law authority, supra ¶ 34, is precisely in line with the governing
    statute. The cases recognize a broad stand-your-ground right of self-
    defense, see State v. Turner, 
    79 P.2d 46
    , 54 (Utah 1938), with a duty to
    retreat only as to trespassers and initial aggressors. See People v. Hite, 
    33 P. 254
    , 257 (Utah Terr. 1893).
    ¶93 The court‘s constitutional authority also falls short. Our
    constitution is undoubtedly ―‗fundamental‘‖ in many senses. See
    supra ¶ 21 (quoting Hansen v. Am. Online, Inc., 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 12, 
    96 P.3d 950
    ). But I cannot agree that the limitations of the constitution
    are our ―‗most fundamental‘‖ expressions of the public policies we
    deem sufficient to override an employer’s interest in regulating the
    workplace. The constitution does not speak to rights in the workplace.
    It preserves fundamental rights of citizenship from incursion by the
    government.
    ¶94 Courts in other jurisdictions have properly observed that
    provisions of federal and state constitutions are ―a problematic
    source of public policy to support a claim of wrongful discharge,
    because most [such] provisions protect only against abuses of
    government power.‖ 2 MARK A. ROTHSTEIN ET AL., EMPLOYMENT LAW
    § 9:9, at 628 (5th ed. 2014) (also noting that ―attempts to assert
    against private sector employers federal and state constitutional
    provisions that require government action generally fail‖).
    ¶95 To date, this court has not embraced this principle. But I
    think we should. If public policy exceptions rooted in the exercise of
    a legal right are limited to rights connected to employment, infra
    ¶ 111, we cannot reflexively extend constitutional limitations on
    governmental power to private employers. We should be skeptical of
    this extension. Private employers, for example, may understandably
    wish to limit their employees‘ speech on matters undermining the
    interests of the employer. That strikes me as perfectly reasonable.
    And an employee who speaks out against an employer should have
    no public policy basis for a wrongful termination suit—regardless of
    the fact that the right of free speech is undoubtedly ―fundamental‖
    when it is infringed by the government. See, e.g., Barr v. Kelso-Burnett
    44
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                             A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    Co., 
    478 N.E.2d 1354
    , 1356–57 (Ill. 1985) (private employers not
    bound under public policy exception to follow Free Speech Clauses
    of federal and state constitution); Prysak v. R.L. Polk Co., 
    483 N.W.2d 629
    , 634 (Mich. Ct. App. 1992) (same).149
    ¶96 Even assuming that the constitutional provisions cited by
    the court are expressions of public policy in the context of employment,
    moreover, the majority still has failed to establish a constitutional
    basis for the public policy it announces. The cited provisions speak at
    too high a level of generality to establish a policy favoring the
    exercise of the right of self-defense in the precise manner identified
    by the court.
    ¶97 Article I, section I recognizes the ―inherent and inalienable
    right‖ of Utahns ―to enjoy and defend their lives and liberties.‖
    Without more, I have no idea what that right entails. The vague,150
    aspirational nature of the text—encompassing the ―right‖ to ―enjoy‖
    our ―lives‖—suggests that this provision was simply the bare bones
    to which the legislature would later add flesh. And the history of this
    149 I do not mean to rule out the possibility of a constitutional
    public policy sufficient to sustain an exception to at-will
    employment. A constitutional right that is connected to the right of
    employment, or in a suit against a public employer, for example,
    might well suffice. But we should not broadly assume that the
    exercise of constitutional rights is a basis for a claim for wrongful
    termination against a private employer. Our cases may have
    reiterated that point repeatedly in dicta, see supra ¶ 24 n.31, but we
    have never found a constitutional policy as a matter of actual
    holding.
    150 The court says it sees ―no ambiguity in the text‖ of this
    provision. Supra ¶ 24 n.32. But it offers no basis for its construction of
    the constitutional text, only an ipse dixit insistence that the
    constitution does not require ―stand-your-ground‖ defense but only
    a limited right (encompassing a duty to retreat). Supra ¶ 31. That is
    not an indication of clarity of the constitutional text, but only of the
    court‘s insistence on finding meaning in it. The court, after all, makes
    only a general nod to its recognition of the ―basic contours‖ of the
    historical right it recognizes. It never attempts to define those
    contours, much less to limit the policy announced today to the terms
    of the historical right. See supra ¶ 24 n.32.
    45
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    provision confirms that conclusion. The debates in the convention
    suggest that this provision was not understood as self-executing.151
    ¶98 Article I, section 6 also falls short of sustaining the right
    embraced by the majority. This provision does not protect a
    freestanding right of self-defense. It establishes ―[t]he individual
    right of the people to keep and bear arms.‖ UTAH CONST. art. I, § 6.
    The reference to ―defense of self‖ is a modifier—one in a series of
    purposes for which an individual has a right to bear arms. In context,
    the terms of this provision are not susceptible to a reading that
    guarantees a freestanding right to ―defense of self.‖ If we adopt such
    a reading, we are implicitly adopting a construction that guarantees
    a freestanding right to ―security‖ and to ―other lawful purposes,‖ as
    those terms are precisely parallel with the reference to ―defense of
    self.‖ Each of those terms—―for security,‖ for ―defense of self,‖ and
    ―for other lawful purposes‖—has a parallel position in the linguistic
    structure of article I, section 6. These are not independently
    protected rights. They are purposes for which the right to bear arms
    may attach. And because the right to bear arms is not at issue in this
    case (and in fact has previously been rejected as a basis for a public
    policy exception to the presumption of at-will employment, see
    Hansen, 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 20), article I, section 6 yields no support for the
    plaintiffs‘ claims.
    ¶99 I can agree with the general proposition that the ―Utah
    Constitution supports the notion that Utah law reflects a state public
    policy in favor of self-defense.‖ Supra ¶ 24 (emphasis added). But that
    statement of state policy is far too general to be helpful. It begs all of
    the important questions about the nature and scope of the right of
    self-defense protected by our law, and against whom it is
    recognized.
    ¶100 The court ultimately answers those questions. Later in its
    opinion the majority asserts that our stand-your-ground statute,
    Utah Code section 76-2-402, ―is not the constitutional minimum.‖
    Supra ¶ 31. It appears to conclude, moreover, that the constitutional
    right of self-defense is one that ―embodies a duty to retreat in some
    151 See 1 PROCEEDINGS AND DEBATES OF THE CONVENTION
    ASSEMBLED TO ADOPT A CONSTITUTION FOR THE STATE OF UTAH 361–62
    (1898) (identifying several delegates referring to ―the inalienable
    right to enjoy and defend [one‘s] lif[e] and liberty‖ as only ―a
    declaration of general principle,‖ comparing it to another provision
    in the Constitution that was merely a ―patriotic utterance‖ and that
    ―the Legislature shall provide how [those rights] will be secured‖).
    46
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                             A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    circumstances,‖ including in the context of employment.152 Supra
    ¶ 32.
    ¶101 That may be a defensible line to draw in the employment
    context. But it is not the line drawn by our law as it currently stands.
    The duty to withdraw attaches by law only to a trespasser or an
    initial aggressor.153 The employee-plaintiffs are neither. See supra
    ¶ 33 (acknowledging that ―employees defending themselves in the
    workplace are [not] on the same footing as a trespasser or someone
    engaged in mutual combat‖). So the right we establish today is not
    one recognized in the ―authoritative sources‖ required by our
    cases—in existing statements of positive law.154 See Touchard, 2006
    152  The basis for this conclusion is unclear, and to me quite
    troubling. I agree that the right of self-defense recognized in our
    caselaw and statutes may not be ―coextensive‖ with the terms of the
    Utah Constitution. But the question of the meaning and scope of the
    operative provisions of our constitution was not addressed in the
    briefs filed in this case. And the court‘s opinion offers no textual or
    originalist analysis of the provisions it cites. It simply asserts that
    stand-your-ground is ―not the constitutional minimum,‖ and that
    some more limited right (encompassing a duty to retreat) is. Supra
    ¶ 31.
    This is not the right case for us to resolve that important question.
    In a future case, in which the legislature restricts the right of self-
    defense and a defendant challenges such restriction on constitutional
    grounds, we may then be positioned to offer a conclusive
    construction of the Utah Constitution‘s protection of the right of self-
    defense. In doing so here, we resolve a significant constitutional
    question in a case in which it is not remotely presented and not
    adequately briefed. I respectfully dissent from that decision.
    153 UTAH CODE § 76-2-402(2)(a)(iii), (3) (providing that a person
    has a ―duty to retreat‖ if he ―was the aggressor,‖ and then must
    ―withdraw[] from the encounter and effectively communicate[] to
    the other person his intent to do so‖); State v. Standiford, 
    769 P.2d 254
    ,
    264 (Utah 1988) (noting that the initial aggressor generally loses the
    right of self-defense); State v. Starks, 
    627 P.2d 88
    , 90 (Utah 1981)
    (same).
    154 The majority asserts that ―Utah did not become a ‗Stand Your
    Ground‘ state until 1994,‖ citing a founding-era statute that it
    portrays as staking out a ―narrower right of self-defense.‖ See supra
    ¶ 31 & n.48 (citing REVISED STATUTES OF UTAH § 75-14-4168(3) (1898)).
    I see no meaningful difference between this statute and our existing
    (Continued)
    47
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    UT 71, ¶ 12 (―A public policy is ‗clear‘ only if plainly defined by
    legislative enactments, constitutional standards, or judicial
    decisions.‖ (internal quotation marks omitted)).
    ¶102 The lack of established legal support for the line drawn by
    the majority should be fatal to the employee-plaintiffs‘ claims. Our
    law has long emphasized the need to maintain careful limitations on
    the sources we look to for the public policies that may override the
    presumption of at-will employment. We have consistently held that
    such policies must be ―plainly defined‖155 by authoritative sources of
    positive law. That restriction is a core element of our doctrine in this
    field,156 for at least three reasons.
    ¶103 First, by limiting wrongful termination claims to cases
    implicating public policies plainly enshrined in existing law, we
    ―avoid unreasonably eliminating employer discretion in discharging
    employees.‖ Ryan v. Dan’s Food Stores, Inc., 
    972 P.2d 395
    , 405 (Utah
    1998). This is important. For reasons noted above, the at-will
    presumption is aimed at preserving active, agile markets for labor. A
    law, however. Both recognize the so-called right to ―stand your
    ground‖ as it currently stands—the general right to use force when
    there is a reasonable apprehension of ―great bodily injury,‖ with the
    exception of a duty to withdraw where the person ―was the assailant
    or engaged in mortal combat.‖ REVISED STATUTES OF UTAH § 75-14-
    4168(3) (1898). Neither this statute nor our current one, Utah Code
    section 76-2-402, leaves any room for the policy endorsed by the
    court today—of a duty to withdraw by a non-trespasser who was not
    the initial aggressor.
    155  Ryan v. Dan’s Food Stores, Inc., 
    972 P.2d 395
    , 405 (Utah 1998)
    (―A public policy is ‗clear‘ only if plainly defined by legislative
    enactments, constitutional standards, or judicial decisions.‖); Rackley
    v. Fairview Care Ctrs., Inc., 
    2001 UT 32
    , ¶ 16, 
    23 P.3d 1022
    (noting that
    a public policy is ―‗clear‘ if it is plainly defined by one of three
    sources‖: statutes, constitutional provisions, or judicial decisions).
    156 I do not doubt that it is within our ―province‖ to announce
    new public policies not enshrined in positive law. Supra ¶ 23. We
    undoubtedly have the power to move in a new direction in this field.
    The presumption of at-will employment is a common law matter.
    We can abandon it entirely if we choose to do so (subject to the right
    of the legislature to override us if it wishes). So we can also surely
    expand on the standards for embracing exceptions as well. Doing so
    strikes me as unwise, however, for reasons highlighted below.
    48
    Cite as: 
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                             A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    broad, undisciplined use of the public policy exception will
    undermine that goal while also interfering with longstanding
    prerogatives of Utah employers.157
    ¶104 Second, a limited conception of the public policy exception
    also protects important reliance interests in the employment
    relationship and provides adequate notice of impending tort
    liability. An employer can, at least arguably, reasonably anticipate
    the imposition of tort liability for wrongful termination in cases
    implicating existing, entrenched legal policies. If we extend the
    public policy exception to newly formulated policies, however, we
    jeopardize the employer‘s reasonable expectations—in a manner
    yielding a troubling extension of tort law. Cf. B.R. ex rel. Jeffs v. West,
    
    2012 UT 11
    ¶¶ 25–28, 
    275 P.3d 228
    (discussing the importance of
    foreseeability in both the duty and proximate cause aspects of a
    negligence claim). No employer can reasonably anticipate the courts‘
    formulation of new public policies as a basis for tort liability. And
    the imposition of wrongful termination liability is troubling in this
    context.
    ¶105 This concern is highlighted by our decision clarifying that
    wrongful termination claims sound in tort (and include the
    possibility of punitive damages). See Peterson v. Browning, 
    832 P.2d 1280
    , 1284 (Utah 1992).158 The potential for such exposure highlights
    157     Hansen v. Am. Online, Inc., 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 9, 
    96 P.3d 950
    (―Owing to the stability and predictability afforded employers and
    employees by the at-will rule, we have been justifiably wary of
    brushing broad public policy landscapes on the canvas of these cases
    . . . .‖); see also supra ¶ 85 n.145.
    158  At least one element of our decision in Peterson has
    subsequently been called into question. Our Peterson opinion
    suggested that the conclusion that ―the public policy exception
    sounds in tort is consistent with our adoption of the tort of
    intentional interference with economic relations in Leigh Furniture &
    Carpet Co. v. Isom, 
    657 P.2d 293
    (Utah 1982),‖ in that ―[t]he discharge
    of an employee because of his failure to violate a clear and
    substantial public policy is an ‗improper purpose‘ under this
    definition.‖ Peterson v. Browning, 
    832 P.2d 1280
    , 1284–85 (Utah 1992).
    Yet the improper purpose basis for an intentional interference claim
    was recently ―abandoned‖ in our caselaw. See Eldridge v. Johndrow,
    
    2015 UT 21
    , ¶ 64, 
    345 P.3d 553
    .
    (Continued)
    49
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    the need for careful, predictable exceptions to the at-will
    presumption. See 
    id. at 1285
    (Howe, A.C.J., concurring) (highlighting
    the need for the public policy exception ―to be applied narrowly and
    only when there exists a violation of a clear and substantial public
    policy,‖ and emphasizing that our limitations on the exception
    assure that it should not be a matter ―of concern to employers who
    are guided by honesty in their employment relations‖). Properly
    restricted, ―[t]he public policy exception is narrow enough in its
    scope and application to be no threat to employers who operate
    within the mandates of the law and clearly established public policy as
    set out in the duly adopted laws.‖ 
    Id. at 1285–86
    (emphasis added)
    (quoting Boyle v. Vista Eyewear, Inc., 
    700 S.W.2d 859
    , 878 (Mo. Ct.
    App. 1985)). A tort claim under this exception, moreover, is aimed at
    deterring activity ―that contravenes clear and substantial public
    policies.‖ 
    Id. at 1285
    (lead opinion of Durham, J.). But these premises
    will not hold for newly announced public policies divorced from
    positive statements of law.
    ¶106 Employers may reasonably anticipate the courts‘
    announcement of public policies set forth in ―duly adopted laws.‖
    And they may accordingly be properly deterred from terminating
    employees on the basis of such policies. But they cannot reasonably
    do so for newly adopted—and judicially adapted—state policies. In
    extending our law to encompass such a policy, the majority ignores
    an important limitation of our law in this field. In so doing,
    moreover, it opens up new vistas of exposure for Utah employers.159
    The Peterson decision still stands, however. And unless and until
    it is overruled, it provides additional grounds for limiting the public
    policy basis for an exception to at-will employment in Utah.
    159 My point is not that the right to sue for termination in
    violation of public policy is limited to positive law ―directly
    regulat[ing]‖ the employment relationship by ―‗restrict[ing] the right
    of an employer to terminate an employee.‘‖ Supra ¶ 59. The majority
    is right that such a limitation would render the public policy
    exception ―meaningless,‖ supra ¶ 59, as there is no need for a
    common law right to sue for wrongful termination where a statutory
    right is already in place. Instead, my point is narrower: In our prior
    cases, we have limited the substance of the public policy we recognize
    as a basis for a claim for wrongful termination to the terms of the
    public policy recognized in our positive law. The court takes a
    significant step away from this important limitation in its decision
    today. In asserting a judicial prerogative of embracing ―public policy
    exceptions . . . not . . . coextensive with the statutes or constitutional
    (Continued)
    50
    Cite as: 
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                             A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    provisions upon which they are based,‖ supra ¶ 54, the majority
    erases (or at least substantially blurs) an important limitation of our
    doctrine in this field.
    Our prior cases have not embraced this prerogative. In defining
    the substantive scope of our state public policy in this field, we have
    limited ourselves to the terms of existing state law. See, e.g., Berube v.
    Fashion Ctr., Ltd., 
    771 P.2d 1033
    , 1043 (Utah 1989) (―In recognizing
    and following principles of public policy, we must be careful to
    avoid overextension of the principles involved.‖); Hodges v. Gibson
    Prods. Co., 
    811 P.2d 151
    , 166 (Utah 1991) (emphasizing that the scope
    of public policy will be provided by ―narrow and clear-cut
    definitions of a specific public policy‖); 
    Ryan., 972 P.2d at 409
    (concluding that an employer violated public policy only if he fired
    an employee for reporting under a statutory duty, and not for
    conduct outside of the ―narrow duty‖ the statute imposed). We have
    not reformulated the terms of existing state policy in the way the
    court does here.
    The cases cited by the majority, supra ¶¶ 55–57, are not to the
    contrary. See Touchard v. La-Z-Boy Inc., 
    2006 UT 71
    , 
    148 P.3d 945
    ;
    Heslop v. Bank of Utah, 
    839 P.2d 828
    (Utah 1992); Peterson, 
    832 P.2d 1280
    ;. These are not cases in which the substantive scope of the state
    public policy that we recognized ―exceeded the statement of positive
    law upon which it was based.‖ Supra ¶ 58. Admittedly the statutes in
    question did not ―prohibit[] an employer from firing someone‖ for
    violating the statute. Supra ¶ 56. But the point is that the underlying
    substantive policy we recognized was precisely the one enshrined in
    statutes—in Peterson, a law upholding the right of an employee to
    ―report[] ‗a violation of a law, or rule promulgated under the law of
    this state, a political subdivision of this state, or any recognized
    entity of the United 
    States‘,‖ 832 P.2d at 1281
    n.2 (quoting Utah
    Code Ann. § 67-21-3(1)); in Heslop, a law penalizing the ―failure or
    refusal to submit accurate and timely call reports‖ to state 
    regulators, 839 P.2d at 837
    (citing UTAH CODE § 7-1-318); and in Touchard, a
    workers compensation provision guaranteeing a right to benefits for
    injuries incurred on the job, 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 12 (citing UTAH CODE
    ANN. §§ 34A–2–105(1)).
    In none of these cases did we recast, limit, or extend the
    substantive policy of the underlying law (e.g., of the right to report a
    violation of law, or of the elements of the law criminalizing accurate
    call reports to state regulators, or of the right of an employee to
    workers compensation benefits). Today‘s opinion breaks new
    ground in this respect. In past cases, we have admittedly ―‗look[ed]
    (Continued)
    51
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    ¶107 Finally, and perhaps most importantly, a closed universe of
    state public policy is essential to the continuing viability of our
    longstanding doctrine of at-will employment. It is one thing to
    impose liability for termination in violation of existing public policy.
    Where we do so we can properly say we are not altering the
    presumption of at-will employment, but only recognizing a narrow
    exception to it. We do great violence to the presumption, however,
    and in fact we effectively repudiate it, where we recognize a right of
    wrongful termination in a case implicating a new public policy of our
    own formulation. In that instance, we are not recognizing an
    exception to the at-will presumption. We are developing a common
    law doctrine of wrongful termination, in which our courts will
    decide, on a case-by-case basis, whether the employer‘s interests are
    sufficient to override the employee‘s, and thus to justify termination
    of employment.
    ¶108 This is a troubling development in our law. And a much
    bigger one than the court‘s opinion acknowledges. I would follow
    the terms of our caselaw as it currently stands. And in so doing I
    would hold that the narrow right of self-defense recognized today is
    not a basis for a wrongful termination claim because it is nowhere
    enshrined in any authoritative statement of law.160
    B
    ¶109 The majority also concludes that our Utah policy of self-
    defense is a matter ―‗of overarching importance to the public as
    opposed to the parties only.‘‖ Supra ¶ 39 (quoting Retherford v. AT&T
    beyond the provision in question to determine whether the
    motivating policy behind it constitutes a clear and substantial public
    policy.‘‖ Supra ¶ 23 (quoting Rackley v. Fairview Care Ctrs., 
    2001 UT 32
    , ¶ 23, 
    23 P.3d 1022
    ). But we have not taken it upon ourselves to
    reformulate the policy of our positive law in this field.
    160 Our law, of course, does recognize a right of self-defense that
    is broader than the one the court endorses. Yet that right—of
    standing your ground, and never retreating even when it is
    reasonably feasible to do so—would clearly have to yield to the
    interests of the employer in maintaining the safety of the workplace.
    See supra ¶¶ 14, 18. So even assuming that a policy recognizing a
    defense to criminal liability is a matter that translates appropriately
    to the employment context, but see supra ¶ 85, our existing policy of
    self-defense cannot sustain a right of action for wrongful
    termination.
    52
    Cite as: 
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                             A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    Commc’ns, 
    844 P.2d 949
    , 966 n.9 (Utah 1992)). Again I see the matter
    differently. In my view the right to self-defense is primarily a private
    matter—a defense from criminal liability, as a privilege to engage in
    aggressive activity that would otherwise be criminal.
    ¶110 The court‘s analysis on this point suffers, at the outset, from
    the problem noted above. Instead of looking for a matter of
    overarching public importance in the exercise of the right of self-
    defense under our law as currently stated, it reframes the analysis. It
    looks for such an interest in that right when exercised in the limited
    manner defined in the majority opinion. Even then, moreover, the
    court does not assert that the exercise of the right of self-defense is a
    matter necessarily benefitting the public. It simply notes that the
    right of self-defense includes the right to defend third parties, and
    thus that its exercise may ―protect[] individuals from serious injuries
    and deter[] the completion of crimes.‖ Supra ¶ 40.
    ¶111 That is insufficient. The mere possibility of protecting the
    public falls far short of the standard the law sets for overriding the
    employer‘s substantial interest in regulating the terms and
    conditions of employment. Where the basis for an exception is the
    exercise of a legal right or privilege, the right in question must
    redound unquestionably to the public good.161 Generally such an
    exception should be limited to the exercise of those rights that relate
    to a worker‘s status as an employee.162 See ROTHSTEIN, supra § 9:11
    161 Touchard v. La-Z-Boy Inc., 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 13, 
    148 P.3d 945
    (when
    determining public policy exceptions, courts consider ―whether the
    public interest is so strong and the policy so clear and weighty that we
    should place the policy beyond the reach of contract‖ (emphasis
    added)(internal quotation marks omitted)); see also Wilburn v. Mid-
    South Health Dev., Inc., 
    343 F.3d 1274
    , 1278 (10th Cir. 2003) (―[T]he
    identified public policy must be truly public, rather than merely
    private or proprietary.‖(internal quotation marks omitted)); Silo v.
    CHW Med. Found., 
    45 P.3d 1162
    , 1166–67 (Cal. 2002) (―The public
    policy that is the basis of this exception must furthermore be ‗public‘
    in that it affects society at large rather than the individual . . . .‖
    (internal quotation marks omitted)).
    162So far as I can tell, our precedents have adhered to this view of
    what ―rights‖ can serve the basis of a public policy exception. See
    Touchard, 
    2006 UT 71
    , ¶ 48 (holding that employees have a wrongful
    discharge claim against their employers if they were terminated for
    exercising their workers‘ compensation rights); Ryan, 
    972 P.2d 395
    ,
    408 (Utah 1998) (noting that ―exercising a legal right or privilege,
    (Continued)
    53
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    (explaining that ―employees must enjoy the right because of their
    status as employees, and not because of some other status they may
    have, such as citizen or taxpayer‖). With respect to those rights, the
    employer has no legitimate ground for intervening. And for that
    reason it can be said that the public interest is ―so clear and weighty
    that we can place the policy beyond the reach of contract.‖ See Ryan
    v. Dan’s Food Stores, Inc., 
    972 P.2d 395
    , 405 (Utah 1998); Hansen, 
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 10 (noting that the principal public policy grounds for
    rebutting the presumption of at-will employment are matters on
    which the employer has ―no legitimate economic objective‖).163
    such as filing a workers‘ compensation claim‖ can serve the basis of
    a public policy exception to at-will (citation omitted)). And we have
    never, to my knowledge, deemed a provision of our constitution to
    establish a public policy exception to the at-will doctrine. See Hansen,
    
    2004 UT 62
    , ¶ 22 (declining to recognize the constitutional right to
    bear arms under the Utah Constitution as a clear and substantial
    public policy to serve the basis of a public policy exception to at-will
    employment); Rackley, 
    2001 UT 32
    , ¶ 20, 23 (declining to recognize
    public policy exceptions emanating from article I, sections 1 and 27
    of the Utah Constitution). This fact significantly erodes the reliance
    on our constitution as serving the basis for exceptions to the at-will
    employment doctrine, dicta in Hansen and other cases, supra ¶ 24
    n.31, notwithstanding.
    163 The majority rebuffs this analysis as incompatible with our
    caselaw as it stands. See supra ¶¶ 43–46. It says that under Hansen
    and other cases, there is no requirement that a public policy
    exception rooted in the exercise of a legal right or privilege ―redound
    unquestionably to the public good.‖ Supra ¶ 42 (internal quotation
    marks omitted). I read our cases differently. I understand the
    cautionary language in Hansen to reflect a need for a limitation on
    the circumstances in which the exercise of a legal right or privilege
    may be enough to sustain a right to sue for wrongful termination.
    And regardless of whether we imposed this limitation explicitly, it
    seems inherent in the general principle employment is
    presumptively at will, and that we depart from that presumption
    only in the limited case in which an employee‘s termination violates
    a public policy that is ―so clear and weighty that we can place the
    policy beyond the reach of contract.‖ See Ryan v. Dan’s Food Stores,
    Inc., 
    972 P.2d 395
    , 405 (Utah 1998). That was certainly a square
    holding of Ryan. And it is deeply embedded in our precedent. We
    should reiterate it here. And doing so requires that we reject a policy
    (Continued)
    54
    Cite as: 
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                             A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    ¶112 The right of self-defense falls short under these standards.
    Such right is not related to the worker‘s status as an employee.164
    And the exercise of this right, as defined by our criminal law, is not a
    matter conceived as an unmitigated good, or on which the employer
    has no legitimate interest.165 Instead, our law of self-defense is rooted
    in a policy recognizing the difficulty of split-second judgments on
    matters of life or death. Under that policy, we give the benefit of the
    doubt to the person who reasonably uses force to defend himself,
    with a privilege from criminal liability even in circumstances where
    less force (or even withdrawal) might ultimately have been
    preferable.166 But the point of the policy is not that every split-second
    like that asserted here—on which the employer has a legitimate basis
    for objecting to the right exercised by the employee.
    164 See Hoven v. Walgreen Co., No. 1:11-cv-881, 
    2012 WL 6025790
    , at
    *5–*6 (W.D. Mich. Dec. 4, 2012) (dismissing claim for wrongful
    termination arising out of employee‘s attempt to thwart an armed
    robbery on the ground that the self-defense provisions cited by the
    plaintiff were ―not directed at conferring rights on employees‖
    (internal quotation marks omitted)).
    165 See Scott v. Extracorporeal, 
    545 A.2d 334
    , 341–43 (Pa. Super. Ct.
    1988) (acknowledging that there are ―‗areas of an employee‘s life in
    which his employer has no legitimate interest,‘‖ but holding that
    regulating the use of force in self-defense is not one of them, given
    that the matter ―strikes entirely too near the employer‘s legitimate
    interest in discharging employees it perceive to be disruptive‖
    (quoting Geary v. U.S. Steel Corp., 
    319 A.2d 174
    , 180 (Pa. 1974));
    McLaughlin v. Barclays Am. Corp., 
    382 S.E.2d 836
    , 840 (N.C. 1989)
    (concluding that the ―kind of deleterious consequences for the
    general public‖ implicated in other cases sustaining a claim for
    wrongful termination in violation of public policy are not involved
    in a case in which the employer fires an employee for breach of
    company policy of de-escalation of violence in the workplace).
    166E.g.,People v. Goetz, 
    497 N.E.2d 41
    , 48 (N.Y. 1986) (observing
    that self-defense law has ―never required that an actor's belief as to
    the intention of another person to inflict serious injury be correct in
    order for the use of deadly force to be justified,‖ but only that ―the
    belief comport with an objective notion of reasonableness‖); Shorter
    v. People, 
    2 N.Y. 193
    , 197 (1849) (―When one who is without fault
    himself, is attacked by another in such a manner or under such
    circumstances as to furnish reasonable ground for apprehending a
    design to take away his life, or do him some great bodily harm, . . .
    (Continued)
    55
    RAY v. WAL-MART
    A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    use of defensive force is in the public interest; it is that criminal
    liability is too big a penalty to impose on a mere error in judgment in
    the heat of a violent confrontation.167
    ¶113 I agree, of course, that our law has long protected an
    individual who exercises such discretion from the imposition of
    criminal liability. But the mere existence of a legal privilege from
    criminal liability tells us little about our public interest in the manner
    in which the right of self-defense is exercised. I find nothing in the
    sources cited in the briefs or in the court‘s opinion suggesting that
    our law favors the exercise of self-defense over a decision to stand
    down or withdraw. In many cases, the split-second decision to fight
    back will appear improvident in hindsight.168 The law of self-defense
    he may safely act upon appearances, and kill the assailant, if that be
    necessary to avoid the apprehended danger; and the killing will be
    justifiable, although it may afterwards turn out that the appearances
    were false, and there was in fact neither design to do him serious
    injury, nor danger that it would be done.‖); 2 WHARTON‘S CRIMINAL
    LAW § 127 (15th ed. 2015) (―A defendant may kill in self-defense
    when he reasonably believes that he is in imminent danger of losing
    his life or suffering great bodily harm. There need not be actual
    danger; it is sufficient merely that defendant believe there is danger,
    provided the belief is reasonable.‖).
    167 As Justice Holmes famously observed, ―[r]ationally‖ failing to
    flea a violent confrontation that ended in death would be ―a
    circumstance to be considered with all others in order to determine
    whether the defendant went farther than he was justified in doing.‖
    Brown v. United States, 
    256 U.S. 335
    , 343 (1921). But the law ―has
    tended in the direction of rules consistent with human nature,‖ and
    therefore for purposes of imposing criminal liability, ―[d]etached
    reflection cannot be demanded in the presence of an uplifted knife.‖
    
    Id. ―[I]t is
    not a condition of immunity that one in that situation
    should pause to consider whether a reasonable man might not think
    it possible to fly with safety or to disable his assailant rather than to
    kill him.‖ 
    Id. 168See,e.g., Shorter,
    2 N.Y. at 197–98 (quoting Chief Justice Parker
    of Massachusetts in the trial of Thomas O. Selfridge (1806); giving
    the hypothetical of an assailant with only powder in his pistol
    threatening the defendant, who then kills the assailant with a club
    only to discover there was no real threat; asserting that self-defense
    requires only a reasonable belief of a threat and not actual danger;
    (Continued)
    56
    Cite as: 
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                              A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    protects the decision regardless. But it does so not because we think
    that aggression is always better than retreat, but because the
    imposition of criminal liability is a harsh consequence.
    ¶114 We cannot decide whether the exercise of the right of self-
    defense will redound to the public good in the abstract. The devil
    will always be in the details. The majority effectively concludes that
    the right of self-defense can preserve and protect human life when it
    is exercised properly. Those are huge caveats. And they highlight the
    fact that the public interest analysis of the exercise of the right of self-
    defense will always require nuanced, case-by-case evaluation. Such
    evaluation is not a matter resolved by our law. It will require case-
    by-case refinement over time.
    ¶115 And that fact reveals a fatal flaw in the majority‘s approach:
    If the public interest in the exercise of the right of self-defense
    depends on case-by-case evaluation, and not wholesale application
    of our law, then it cannot be said that our policy redounds
    unquestionably to the public good, or that the matter falls beyond
    the reach of contract.169
    ¶116 An individual confronted by an assailant faces a
    dilemma—of whether to retreat or fight back. He may properly
    choose the former, even in the face of an imminent risk of injury.
    Doing so in no way undermines our public policy. 170
    concluding that any ―different rule would lay too heavy a burden
    upon poor humanity‖).
    169 See 
    Scott, 545 A.2d at 342
    –43 (concluding, given the summary
    judgment ―posture of th[e] case,‖ that the employee-plaintiff ―acted
    in self-defense,‖ but rejecting the public policy basis of a wrongful
    discharge claim nonetheless—explaining that ―the employer held her
    at least partially accountable for the disturbance,‖ and that second-
    guessing that judgment ―‗would have the unwise effect of
    transferring to the judicial forum the duty of evaluating the
    propriety of management decisions‘‖ (quoting Rossi v. Pa. State
    Univ., 
    489 A.2d 828
    , 836 (Pa. Super. Ct. 1985)).
    170 In my view the concession that ―Wal-Mart‘s policy may be
    consistent with the clear and substantial public policy‖ recognized
    by the court, supra ¶ 52, should be dispositive. If Wal-Mart‘s policy is
    consistent with the right of self-defense the court recognizes, then an
    employee‘s agreement to follow that policy should be enforceable.
    57
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    C
    ¶117 The majority‘s final conclusion is that the public policy
    protecting the right of self-defense ―outweighs employers‘ interest in
    being able ‗to manage their workforces and regulate their workplace
    environments to promote productivity, security, and similarly lawful
    business objectives.‘‖ Supra ¶ 47 (quoting Touchard, 
    2006 UT 71
    ,
    ¶ 17). Again the court‘s analysis is dependent on its framing of the
    question, however. Thus, in light of the summary judgment posture
    of the case (in which all reasonable inferences are given to the
    nonmoving parties), the majority assumes that the employee-
    plaintiffs ―were ‗unable to safely disengage‘ from a threat of
    violence.‖ Supra ¶ 51. And it even indicates that they ―face[d] the
    prospect of severe injury or death with no opportunity to
    withdraw.‖ Supra ¶ 51. In these circumstances, the court concludes
    that the right of self-defense outweighs the employer‘s interest in
    controlling its workplace, asserting that ―[t]he law should not
    require employees to choose between keeping their jobs and
    protecting themselves or others from a serious, imminent threat of
    harm.‖ Supra ¶ 51.
    ¶118 As noted above, however, we have no reason to assume
    that these employees were really ―unable to safely engage,‖ much
    less that they faced ―severe injury or death.‖ Those premises are
    merely an artifact of the procedural posture of the case. And it may
    well turn out—and for reasons noted above, supra ¶¶ 8–9, I think it
    likely will—that the stronger inference is that the employee-plaintiffs
    in this case fought back unnecessarily. It also seems quite likely that
    most workers who are fired for defending themselves will fit that bill.
    It would be the rare employer indeed who would actually fire an
    employee for defending himself in the face of a threat of ―severe
    injury or death with no opportunity to withdraw.‖ Supra ¶ 51.
    ¶119 Because that prospect seems so unlikely, moreover, I rather
    doubt that many employees faced with a life-or-death threat will
    actually stand down due to concerns over losing their job. That will
    surely be the outlier case. The more common case, by far, will be the
    opposite—in which the employee faced with less than a life-or-death
    threat, or with reasonable path to withdraw, nonetheless intervenes
    in an attempt at vigilantism.
    ¶120 The majority concedes that the employer‘s interests
    outweigh the employee‘s in this latter circumstance. See supra ¶ 52.
    Yet it opens the door to claims for wrongful termination that
    substantially undermine the employer‘s ability to protect that
    interest. The threat of a tort claim for wrongful termination will yield
    substantial leverage for the employee who is fired for fighting back
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    in the face of workplace violence. If, as I suspect is the case, most
    such employees will fall more in the vigilante camp than the life-or-
    death without the possibility of retreat camp, the net effect of today‘s
    decision will be to increase vigilantism.
    ¶121 We should not formulate policy in this sensitive area on the
    basis of the outlier case. The majority assumes this case is the outlier
    in light of the procedural posture of summary judgment. But I doubt
    that assumption reflects reality. And the decision protecting the right
    to sue in this outlier circumstance seems sure to do more harm than
    good.171
    ¶122 I would reject the employee-plaintiffs‘ proffered basis for a
    public policy exception to the presumption of at-will employment.
    For reasons noted below, I find substantial support for my analysis
    in our own precedents and in those from other jurisdictions.
    1
    ¶123 Our decision in Hansen v. America Online, 
    2004 UT 62
    , 
    96 P.3d 950
    , seems to me to strongly undermine the employee-
    plaintiffs‘ claims in this case. Hansen rejects a public policy basis for a
    wrongful termination claim under the Utah Constitution, and
    implementing provisions of the Utah Code, protecting the individual
    right to bear arms. 
    Id. ¶¶ 15–22
    (citing UTAH CONST. art. I, § 6; UTAH
    CODE § 63-98-102). The plaintiffs in Hansen cited these provisions as
    sustaining their legal right to bear arms in the workplace, and thus to
    sue for wrongful termination when their employer fired them for
    bringing their guns to work. We rejected that argument,
    emphasizing the high bar for establishing a public policy exception
    based on the exercise of a legal right or privilege.
    ¶124 First, we noted that the ―exercise[] [of] a legal right or
    privilege‖ ―poses analytical challenges different from, and generally
    171   The majority claims that such considerations are mere
    ―speculation,‖ and ―not relevant to deciding whether self-defense‖
    sustains a public policy exception to at-will employment. Supra ¶ 65.
    I disagree. The operative test expressly invites us to determine
    whether a purported right outweighs an employer‘s concrete and
    unquestioned interest in controlling the workplace. In order to do so,
    we must assess the likelihood that such terminations will occur, and
    balance this likelihood against the very real risk of increased
    litigation and the second-guessing of the employer‘s judgment. That
    is the essence of the public policy analysis called for in our cases. We
    cannot properly eschew it as irrelevant, or speculative.
    59
    RAY v. WAL-MART
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    greater than, the other[]‖ recognized grounds for a public policy
    exception to the presumption of at-will employment. 
    Id. ¶ 10.
    With
    respect to the other grounds, for example, we emphasized that an
    employer‘s decision to terminate an employee generally ―serves no
    legitimate economic objective and corrodes civil society.‖ 
    Id. That point
    is clear, for example, with respect to a termination of
    employment based on an employee‘s refusal to ―commit an illegal or
    wrongful act,‖ or decision to perform a ―public obligation,‖ or to
    report to a ―public authority criminal activity of the employer.‖ See
    
    id. ¶ 9
    (internal quotation marks omitted) (citing 
    Ryan, 972 P.2d at 408
    ) (listing these other grounds for public policy exception). Yet
    that does not necessarily hold for a termination based on an
    employee‘s exercise of a legal right. An employer may have an
    entirely legitimate interest in that circumstance. See 
    id. ¶ 11
    (noting
    that in this context ―both the employer and the employee may
    appeal to public policy in aid of their cause‖). And the employer‘s
    interests may well outweigh the employee‘s. See 
    id. (indicating that
    ―[t]he analysis of whether the public policy exception applies to a
    particular legal right or privilege will frequently require a balancing
    of competing legitimate interests: the interests of the employer to
    regulate the workplace environment to promote productivity,
    security, and similar lawful business objectives, and the interests of
    the employees to maximize access to their statutory and
    constitutional rights within the workplace‖).
    ¶125 In Hansen we found the employer‘s interests to prevail.
    And we based that decision on our determination that the governing
    constitutional and statutory provisions did not conclusively establish
    that an employer‘s ―fundamental‖ interest in controlling its ―private
    property‖ ―must give way‖ to the ―right to possess firearms‖ in
    safeguarding ―private and public security.‖ 
    Id. ¶ 21
    (noting that the
    employee-plaintiffs had cited ―evidence that private and public
    security is better safeguarded by an armed citizenry‖). Citing the
    legislative debate on the operative statute, we found a lack of
    ―clarity‖ in the alleged legislative intent to elevate the right to
    possess firearms over ―the rights of an employer.‖ 
    Id. ¶ 24.
    And
    finding at most ―ambivalence‖ on the part of the legislature on this
    matter, we rejected the employees‘ claim, concluding that they had
    failed to carry their burden of showing that the right to bear arms
    clearly outweighed the employer‘s right to preserve the safety of its
    private property. 
    Id. ¶126 The
    above analysis applies with equal force to this case.
    Nothing in the Utah stand-your-ground statute suggests that the
    legislature intended to elevate the right of self-defense above the
    rights of an employer to preserve the safety of its workplace. The
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    criminal law of self-defense, in fact, has long been understood to
    harbor ―ambivalence‖ on the prudence of any particular act of
    defensive aggression, so long as there was an objectively reasonable
    basis for it.172 That is evident in the fact that not all forms of
    aggression that are justified under the criminal law seem appropriate
    in hindsight.173 Again, a person subjected to attack may reasonably
    choose to stand down or seek to retreat even when that course seems
    difficult. Nothing in our law indicates any ―clarity‖ on the part of
    our legislature in extending the terms of a privilege from criminal
    liability to a legal right of employment. I see no basis for concluding
    that our legislature intended to elevate the right of self-defense as
    defined in our criminal law over the important right of an employer
    to protect the security of its workplace in the manner it sees fit.
    ¶127 Indeed, the lack of criminal liability when an employee
    meets force with force in the workplace tells us nothing of relevance to
    172 See, e.g., 
    Brown, 256 U.S. at 343
    (noting that self-defense as a
    shield from criminal liability has never required ―that one in [a
    seemingly life-threatening] situation should pause to consider
    whether a reasonable man might not think it possible to fly with
    safety or to disable his assailant rather than to kill him‖).
    173 See, e.g. Annie Wells, Note, Home on the Gun Range: Discussing
    Whether Kansas’s New Stand Your Ground Statute Will Protect Gun
    Owners Who Use Disproportionate Force in Self-Defense, 56 U. KAN. L.
    REV. 983, 983–84 (2008) (noting the acquittal of a defendant under the
    Stand Your Ground statute where the defendant got into a verbal
    altercation with two men, flashed a gun, and then when the other
    men returned with a third man in a car, shot five times through the
    windshield then walked over to the car and shot nine more times
    into the driver‘s side window, killing two of the three mean inside);
    Zachary L. Weaver, Note, Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” Law: The
    Actual Effects and the Need for Clarification, 63 U. MIAMI L. REV. 395,
    413–14 (2008) (noting an incident where a masked man was in his
    mother‘s backyard carrying a small souvenir baseball bat in order to
    protect his mother‘s property from another neighbor she suspected
    had stolen things from her; that neighbor became alerted to someone
    ―lurking in the bushes behind the backyard,‖ and pulled a knife on
    him; then the neighbor‘s father saw the stand-off and shot the
    masked man even though he was still on his mother‘s property; the
    prosecutor did not charge based on Stand Your Ground, but
    commented: ―Nobody involved in this decision feels good about it.‖)
    (internal quotation marks omitted).
    61
    RAY v. WAL-MART
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    the question as framed in Hansen—of whether the legislature has
    spoken with ―clarity‖ on an intent to elevate an individual‘s exercise
    of the right of self-defense over ―the rights of an employer‖ to
    control the workplace. 
    Id. ¶ 24.
    In my view it has not. The legislature
    has said nothing on the question whether a policy preserving for the
    employer the final say on the reasonableness of any particular act of
    self-defense is an agreement void against public policy.
    2
    ¶128 Unlike the majority, I view the authority cited by Wal-Mart
    as thoroughly persuasive. See supra ¶¶ 66–72 (citing cases from three
    state supreme courts and two federal courts). The cited cases
    undermine the majority‘s approach and reinforce a number of the
    elements of my analysis.
    ¶129 In Scott v. Extracorporeal, Inc., for example, the Pennsylvania
    Supreme Court contrasts a dispute over the proper exercise of the
    right of self-defense with ―areas of an employee‘s life in which his
    employer has no legitimate interest.‖ 
    545 A.2d 334
    , 341 (Pa. Super.
    Ct. 1988) (internal quotation marks omitted). The Scott court
    assumes, moreover, that the employee-plaintiff in that case ―acted in
    self-defense,‖ noting that this assumption is dictated by the
    summary judgment posture of the case. 
    Id. at 342.
    But it nonetheless
    declines to ―deny the employer the right to dismiss due to its
    subjective evaluation that the employee behaved disruptively.‖ 
    Id. And it
    ultimately upholds the employer‘s prerogative to resolve
    disputes on such questions, moreover, highlighting concerns with
    ―transferring to the judicial forum the duty of evaluating the
    propriety of management decisions.‖ 
    Id. at 343
    (internal quotation
    marks omitted).
    ¶130 The North Carolina Court of Appeals‘ analysis in
    McLaughlin v. Barclays Am. Corp., 
    382 S.E.2d 836
    (N.C. Ct. App. 1989),
    rests on similar conclusions. In that case the court ―accept[s]‖ the
    employee-plaintiff‘s ―contention that his striking his subordinate
    resulted solely from his efforts to protect himself from battery,‖
    given the need to view the evidence in the light most favorable to the
    nonmoving party. 
    Id. at 838.
    But the McLaughlin court nonetheless
    proceeds to reject the claim to a public policy exception. In so doing,
    it concedes that the evidence, in the light most favorable to the
    employee-plaintiff, ―shows that his superiors displayed virtual
    indifference to his repeated requests for help in dealing with a
    problem employee,‖ and that their investigation of the incident in
    question was ―shallow and perfunctory.‖ 
    Id. at 840.
    But McLaughlin
    nonetheless concludes that there was no basis for a wrongful
    termination claim under a public policy exception, emphasizing that
    62
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                            A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    there was no basis for finding ―bad faith‖ by the employer, and
    highlighting the problem with a contrary holding: ―Were we to
    recognize a cause of action in this case,‖ the court warns, ―every
    employee involved in an altercation would assert a self-defense
    justification, spawning [a] deluge‖ of litigation undermining the
    employer‘s prerogative of controlling the workplace. Id.; see also
    Bagwell v. Peninsula Reg’l Med. Ctr., 
    665 A.2d 297
    , 312–13 (Md. Ct.
    Spec. App. 1995) (quoting the foregoing portion of McLaughlin
    approvingly).
    ¶131 The majority seeks to distinguish these cases on the ground
    that they involved plaintiffs who ―articulated a right of self-defense
    that encompassed instances where employees used force in
    retaliation or in circumstances where there was an opportunity to
    withdraw.‖ Supra ¶ 67. That is an accurate characterization of the
    employer‘s position in the above cases. But it overlooks the
    employee‘s view, which is accepted by the court for purposes of
    summary judgment. And, as noted, the courts in Scott, McLaughlin,
    and Bagwell all accept the employee‘s assertion of reasonable self-
    defense for purposes of their analysis. But they nonetheless reject the
    assertion of a public policy right to sue for wrongful termination on
    the basis of a need to respect employer discretion in this sensitive
    area.174
    174 As the majority indicates, Bagwell states that ―all the evidence‖
    presented in that case ―point[ed] to the conclusion‖ that the
    employee was fired because the employer believed she ―acted in
    retaliation.‖ Supra ¶ 67 (quoting Bagwell v. Peninsula Reg’l Med. Ctr.,
    
    665 A.2d 297
    , 313 (Md. Ct. Spec. App. 1995)). But that consideration
    was not dispositive in Bagwell. The court also emphasized the
    summary judgment posture of the case. 
    Id. at 311
    (giving the
    employee the benefit of the doubt on a disputed issue, based on the
    summary judgment ―posture of the case‖). And it quoted McLaughlin
    at length for the proposition that an employer‘s decision might be
    based on ―‘perfunctory‘‖ analysis but still not be shown to be in
    ―‘bad faith.‘‖ 
    Id. In so
    doing, the Bagwell court emphasized the need
    for deference to the employer‘s subjective judgment, while warning
    of the troubling effect of a ―deluge‖ of suits allowing courts to
    second-guess the employer‘s decision. 
    Id. (internal quotation
    marks
    omitted).
    The fact that the evidence was one-sided in Bagwell is accordingly
    beside the point of its principal analysis. And in any event, the
    court‘s observation does not at all apply here. Here the record is
    (Continued)
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    RAY v. WAL-MART
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    ¶132 I would resolve this case on that basis. I would uphold the
    enforceability of Wal-Mart‘s arrangement with its employees—an
    arrangement, from all that appears, that is in line with that adopted
    by retailers far and wide. And I would reject the employee-plaintiffs‘
    assertion of a public policy basis for a wrongful termination claim
    regardless of the premise on summary judgment that they acted
    reasonably in self-defense and lacked a reasonable means of
    withdrawal.175
    II
    ¶133 I agree with the majority that our public policy in Utah
    encompasses the goal of ―preserv[ing] and protect[ing] human life.‖
    Supra ¶ 40. But I see no reason to believe that an agreement like that
    which Wal-Mart has with its associates—of requiring them to retreat
    instead of fighting back, reserving a right of self-defense if necessary,
    and leaving the resolution of doubts on whether the policy was
    followed to the employer—will undermine that policy. If anything,
    Wal-Mart‘s arrangement will preserve and protect human life in the
    long run. Presumably that‘s why such policies are endorsed in
    occupational safety standards and adopted by so many retailers.
    ¶134 The court‘s contrary conclusion seems to me to run a
    substantial risk of thwarting the very policy it is touting. In
    upholding the employee-plaintiffs‘ right to sue, the court is
    undermining the ability of retailers like Wal-Mart to enforce their
    policies of nonresistance in the workplace. The inevitable result will
    be more violence, not less.
    ¶135 In the long run, the majority‘s decision also threatens
    substantial violence to the at-will presumption under Utah law. If
    the public policy exception does not depend on the identification of
    much more ambiguous, and much more open to two different
    conclusions.
    175 That conclusion need not foreclose the possibility of all such
    claims by all employees in this area. As the North Carolina Court of
    Appeals indicated in McLaughlin, the rejection of a public policy
    basis for a wrongful termination claim in a circumstance in which
    the employer‘s decision was not made in bad faith need not ―close
    doors to plaintiffs who are able to show bad faith by the employer.‖
    
    McLaughlin, 382 S.E.2d at 840
    . No such showing can plausibly be
    made in this case, however, as the facts are such that Wal-Mart, at a
    minimum, can be said to have made a good faith determination that
    its employees fought back when they should have retreated instead.
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                              A.C.J. Lee, dissenting
    an existing policy in authoritative sources of law, we will no longer
    have an at-will presumption. We will have a common law of
    wrongful termination.
    ¶136 Even in the field of self-defense, I doubt this case will be
    our final say on the availability of an employee‘s right to sue for
    wrongful termination. More difficult cases undoubtedly loom on the
    horizon.
    ¶137 Consider, for example, a case of third-party defense, in
    which an employee intervenes to protect a co-worker who is under a
    threat of violence by an armed robber 100 feet away. The employee‘s
    decision to intervene—to run across the room to confront the
    robber—would be justified under our law of self-defense.176 But does
    our Utah public policy clearly encourage such acts of vigilantism—or
    clearly bar an employer from terminating an employee who engages
    in such activity? See supra ¶ 40 (basing the conclusion that the right
    of self-defense is of public importance on the fact that our law
    encompasses ―the doctrine of defense of others‖). The majority
    seems to suggest so. It asserts that the exercise of the right of defense
    of a third party ―protects individuals from serious injuries and deters
    the completion of crime.‖ Supra ¶ 40. But I see nothing in our law to
    support that conclusion. And workplace de-escalation policies (and
    the social science studies behind them) suggest that the opposite
    approach is likely preferable in the broad run of cases. See supra ¶ 76
    n.138.
    ¶138 Alternatively, consider the circumstance of a bank teller
    who receives a note from an armed robber that says ―Hand over the
    money in your till, and no one gets hurt,‖ but responds by trying to
    disarm the gunman. Again the teller would be fully justified under
    our criminal law—even if the attempt at intervention causes the
    gunman to open fire on the teller and on other innocent bystanders.
    But is this exercise of self-defense so clearly in the public interest that
    an employer violates public policy for firing the employee for this act
    of vigilantism? The majority‘s analysis suggests that that would be
    the case. The teller, after all, is in no better position to retreat than the
    Wal-Mart associates at issue in this case. Yet again it seems to me
    176  See UTAH CODE § 76-2-402(1)(a), (b) (noting that a ―person is
    justified in threating or using force [or deadly force] . . . to the extent
    that the person reasonably believes that force [or deadly force] is
    necessary to defend the person or a third person against another
    person‘s imminent use of unlawful force,‖ used of deadly force, or
    ―commission of a forcible felony‖ (emphasis added)); supra ¶ 40.
    65
    RAY v. WAL-MART
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    that the bank employer would be acting entirely reasonably in
    holding its employees to the requirement of turning over the money
    instead of fighting back in this instance. And the reasonableness of
    such a decision should sustain the bank‘s right to terminate the
    teller‘s employment without facing the potential liability of a
    wrongful termination claim.
    ¶139 Perhaps the majority would respond to these scenarios by
    adding new limitations on the policy of self-defense that it adopts
    today. As these or other cases arise, perhaps the court will say that
    our state policy of self-defense is restricted not only by a duty to
    retreat when reasonable, but also by a bank teller‘s duty to accede to
    a demand for money instead of fighting back, or by an employee‘s
    duty to stand down instead of intervening to help a co-worker.
    Those would be wise limitations if our goal is preserving safety in
    the workplace. But they are nowhere found on the face of the court‘s
    opinion, and they would further underscore the violence that today‘s
    decision does to our longstanding presumption of at-will
    employment.
    ¶140 We should limit public policy grounds for wrongful
    termination suits to cases involving the exercise of rights of
    employment enshrined in our law as written. I dissent from the
    majority‘s creation of a right of wrongful termination based on a
    policy of its own formulation, as that decision threatens workplace
    safety and undermines our longstanding presumption of at-will
    employment.
    66